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Borders of Israel were defined after all! Such good news!   Africa and the Middle East

Started Nov-22 by BerrySteph; 236 views.
BerrySteph

From: BerrySteph

Nov-22

https://mondoweiss.net/2014/11/documents-borders-palestine/
PARTITION PLAN, UN 1947, WITH ’49 ARMISTICE DELINEATED

It is a source of great sadness to me that the Zionists have long refused to tell me which Israel in what borders they they demand that I recognise. 

I'm happy to say there was an answer to my  question all along and I'm delighted to share it with you.

The hidden documents that reveal the true borders of Israel and Palestine 

NOVEMBER 5, 2014 - I once believed that Israel has never defined its borders. It was one of those things that “everyone knows”.

... many readers here will be familiar with the document to which he pointed me: the letter written by Eliahu Epstein, the representative of the Jewish Agency in Washington, to President Truman and to the State Department, on May 14, 1948.

Epstein’s letter to Truman

... the letter ... formally requested the United States to recognize the new State of Israel which was about to be declared in Tel Aviv ... :

My dear Mr. President, I have the honor to notify you that the State of Israel has been proclaimed as an independent republic within the frontiers approved by the General Assembly of the United Nations in its Resolution of November 29, 1947.

(The full text is given in the link above, and also appears below.) The resolution referred to, UNGA Resolution 181, recommended the partition of Palestine into separate Jewish and Arab states. The Zionist leadership had publicly accepted the Partition Plan, and this letter defines the borders of Israel to be those specified in the Plan (see map attached).

As soon as I read the words “proclaimed… within the frontiers…” I knew that I had been fooled by Zionist propaganda ... a state without defined borders is ... nonsensical. 

... The Montevideo Convention [1933] lists the following requirements for the existence of a state: a permanent population; a defined territory; government, and the capacity to enter into relations with other states. If Israel had really been declared as a state without borders, it would not have been a state at all ...

Israel’s Declaration of Independence

Israel was reluctant to define its borders. According to an article on the Israel Government website, the Provisional Government of Israel met in Tel Aviv from May 12 to May 14 to consider the draft declaration of independence. It was led by David Ben-Gurion ... [h]e wanted to create the sort of chaotic situation I outlined in my Canada-USA illustration. If there was no defined border between Israel and the rest of Palestine, then all of Palestine could be considered open territory, available for conquest.There were heated discussions about the borders. Some said stick to the Partition Plan borders, while Ben-Gurion argued strongly that they should say nothing about the borders, because it was his intention to capture territory outside the Partition Plan borders and include it in the state. His view was accepted by a vote of five to four in favor, with the four other members being absent. This vote is the origin of the story that “Israel has never defined its borders”. Ben-Gurion ... completely rewrote the draft declaration of independence, removing all references to the Partition Plan.

On May 14, the Ben-Gurion’s rewritten draft was ... approved unanimously on the second vote ... changes were made ... if we look at the text of the Declaration of the Establishment of the State of Israel we see that the references to the Partition Plan have been restored. Indeed, the Partition Plan is placed at the heart of the Declaration:

WE… BY VIRTUE OF OUR NATURAL AND HISTORIC RIGHT AND ON THE STRENGTH OF THE RESOLUTION OF THE UNITED NATIONS GENERAL ASSEMBLY, HEREBY DECLARE THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A JEWISH STATE IN ERETZ-ISRAEL, TO BE KNOWN AS THE STATE OF ISRAEL.

It is greatly to be appreciated that this question of mine does indeed have an answer and it was known all along.

  • Edited November 22, 2020 1:43 pm  by  BerrySteph
In reply toRe: msg 1
BerrySteph

From: BerrySteph

Nov-22

From the same article - who falsely claimed that Israel has no borders and how to become something that "everyone knows"?

... "everyone" includes some surprising people: the historian Avi Shlaim, Professor at Oxford University, said in an interview that "the Armistice Lines are the only internationally recognized borders that Israel ever had"; Francis A. Boyle, Professor of International Law at the University of Illinois is the adviser to the PLO, already mentioned, who said that "Israel does not have determinate borders"; Uri Avnery, veteran Israeli journalist, politician and peace activist, has said that "from its first day, the State of Israel has refused to fix its borders"; Jeremy R. Hammond, editor of Foreign Policy Journal, in his book The Rejection of Palestinian Self Determination (Chapter IV) says, of the creation of Israel, "significantly, no borders for the newly proclaimed state were specified"; John B. Judis, political historian, in his recent book Genesis about Truman, Zionism, and the creation of Israel, discusses the events of May 14, 1948 in Washington (page 317), mentioning that Clifford worked with Epstein on the letter asking for recognition, but shows no knowledge of its content and gives no reference to the text.

Jenifer (Zarknorph)
Host

From: Jenifer (Zarknorph)

Nov-23

Thank you for starting an original discussion.

I found this image interesting.

https://s22592.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/Mahmoud-Abbas-map-UN-Feb-11-2020-1200xpx.jpg

But it comes attached to an article.

BerrySteph

From: BerrySteph

Nov-23

Your source is deeply unpleasant nonsense - but in this case is simply confirming what I've said.

This is the greatest of the misleading Palestinian maps. What Abbas calls the map of 1967 is in actuality the armistice lines Israel signed with Jordan and Egypt in 1949 after Israel’s War of Independence. In international law, armistice lines are not borders; they merely mark breaks in the fighting. So these were never internationally recognized borders. 

Which is the same as what I said - they were not "international borders".

But the previous panel of that graphic is Israel's border - and the only one ever recognised by anyone.

Meanwhile you're quoting a disgusting hasbarist source which attacks journalists, including Jews, and contributes to helping Israel silence any reporter who looks at what's going on.

I've proved, the Zionists wanted Holocaust I - and I put it you that they have been intent on perpetrating their own Holocaust II since about 1956 - with significant escalations in every decade since.

I only wonder whether its your family or your friends or your boss who impose this orthodoxy on you.

Jenifer (Zarknorph)
Host

From: Jenifer (Zarknorph)

Nov-24

BerrySteph said:

Your source is deeply unpleasant nonsense...

But it was in writing!

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