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Delta Air Lines jacks up health insurance premiums for unvaccinated employees   America - all of it

Started Aug-27 by Raven2018; 6744 views.
Raven2018

From: Raven2018

Sep-10

Jenifer (Zarknorph) said:

Raven2018 said: How can the passengers blame Delta, when they could have already had Covid-19 when they boarded the plane?

You underestimate many people's ability to blame anyone else.

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They would have to "prove" their case ... and it would be impossible for them to do so.

Raven2018

From: Raven2018

Sep-10

Jenifer (Zarknorph) said:

Support universal healthcare. Then medical insurance won't be left up to employers. Problem solved.

**********************************   

Cons:

1. Higher taxes. The rich pay for the health care of the poor. Healthier people pay for those who need regular treatment. People with chronic diseases like the ones suffering from diabetes and heart disease are a colossal burden on the system. The sickest people consume half of the healthcare costs and the healthiest 50%  of the people consume only 3% of the cost.

2. Longer wait times for physician appointments and procedures, emergency rooms start getting misused and overcrowded.

3. The policies of the government pretty much dictate money a doctor can make. Both an excellent and a mediocre doctor make nearly the same amount of money. Less competition means less innovation.

4. Dental and Vision are generally not covered  (or not fully covered) under Universal Health Care. People still have to buy those.

5. People are less careful about their health, as there is no financial impact.

6. Health care costs overwhelm government budgets. It creates socialism and more government debt.

7. Doctors are often assigned more patients than they can legitimately handle, which can deteriorate the accuracy and quality of patient care.

8. Medicine becomes a less attractive career choice. The cost of becoming a doctor is very high. Doctors often carry large student loans. Additionally, it takes nearly a decade of hard-core education and training before one starts practicing. Since their income is capped under Universal Health Care, it will take longer for them to pay off their student loans, and force young doctors to lead a more frugal life for a long time.

9. Innovation can fall behind when compared to a free-market system. This also creates a shortage of specialist doctors in the long run.

10. May restrict access to certain procedures or medications. These systems might choose palliative care over life-saving measures.

11. Smokers, Alcoholics and Drug Addicts, receive the same treatment, even though their conditions are self-induced.

12. Many dual citizens will work in another country all their life but return for free treatment when they need long-term care.

13. USA has too many senior citizens. For years to come the average age of our population will keep rising. There will be lesser people who will contribute to the system versus who will land up using it.

14. Systems are never perfect. Doctors, their families, their close friends of doctors and some influential people are often able to get quicker treatment due to mutual understanding within them.

15. It will lead to mass layoffs for millions of Americans connected to medical insurance directly and indirectly.

16. Healthy people who may hardly use the healthcare system, are forced to pay. Obamacare is not a universal healthcare system, Medicare for all can provide coverage for all.

17. Due to the non-payment of medical bills, doctors and hospitals have to hire collection agencies which results in more paperwork for everyone, plus they have to pay commissions that debt collectors charge.

Due to the colossal federal budget deficits, a universal healthcare system seems to be a distant dream. Moreover, due to the coronavirus pandemic, trillions of dollars worth of assistance were given to US citizens and small businesses, causing America to further drown in debt. Not everyone agrees that taxing the rich is the right approach as they may relocate to countries that have a cheaper tax rate, which will further hurt the economy.

The universal healthcare system is not happening in America any time soon. Possibly never in our lifetime. With US debt already over 30 trillion dollars, where is the money left? Many citizens feel that the government has left them behind.

The truth is that despite being the most powerful country in this world, we have the worst government when it comes to discipline.

https://nexacollect.com/medical/free-health-care/

Jenifer (Zarknorph)
Host

From: Jenifer (Zarknorph)

Sep-11

Raven2018 said:

They would have to "prove" their case ... and it would be impossible for them to do so.

Not necessarily.

If multiple people who tested negative before getting on the plane then tested positive - that's a fair case.

Jenifer (Zarknorph)
Host

From: Jenifer (Zarknorph)

Sep-11

Raven2018 said:

1. Higher taxes. The rich pay for the health care of the poor. Healthier people pay for those who need regular treatment. People with chronic diseases like the ones suffering from diabetes and heart disease are a colossal burden on the system. The sickest people consume half of the healthcare costs and the healthiest 50%  of the people consume only 3% of the cost.

Can't argue with this.  

Raven2018 said:

2. Longer wait times for physician appointments and procedures, emergency rooms start getting misused and overcrowded.

Medicare for all can work in tandem with private health insurance.  There are plenty of models to look at throughout the world.

Raven2018 said:

3. The policies of the government pretty much dictate money a doctor can make. Both an excellent and a mediocre doctor make nearly the same amount of money. Less competition means less innovation.

No. A schedule fee is set.  Also, this is a GOOD thing.  It ensures the patients are not getting ripped off and gives them a better idea of what a procedure SHOULD cost.  

Raven2018 said:

4. Dental and Vision are generally not covered  (or not fully covered) under Universal Health Care. People still have to buy those.

Here - dental is not (very annoying) but eyes are certainly covered.  I get a yearly eye test for free.  You walk into ANY optometrist and see a doctor.  Yes, they then try to sell you glasses.  But you don't have to buy any and will walk out with your prescription.  That's just one example of the business sector picking up some of the slack - and the cost.

Raven2018 said:

5. People are less careful about their health, as there is no financial impact.

There is absolutely no basis for this claim.  People in the UK or France or Australia are not less healthy than Americans.

Jenifer (Zarknorph)
Host

From: Jenifer (Zarknorph)

Sep-11

You skipped the other list...

Pros:

1. The best part, everyone is covered, and no need to buy health insurance anymore. More than 45 million Americans who do not have health insurance today will have it under the Universal Health Care system.

2. A healthier society, the number of people dying due to lack of treatment reduces drastically. For example – The lifespan of Canadians is longer than the of Americans.

3. Cost of treatment goes down because in a private health care system costs are substantially inflated. The government healthcare system is more regulated, and the cost of treatment for various healthcare conditions is pre-defined and fixed. It is overall a more effective model. There are no headaches or stress of dealing with private insurance companies. The same standard of service for everyone at a low cost.

4. Removes the disparity, everyone has the same insurance plan, irrespective of his/her social or financial status.

5. Companies do not have to worry about providing health insurance to their employees and can focus entirely on running their business. Universal healthcare for all also encourages entrepreneurship. This could reduce employer labor costs by about 10%.

6. Health care costs are the number one reason for bankruptcy in America; this problem disappears.

7. Eliminates the administrative costs for doctors as well as they have to deal with only one government agency rather than ten different insurance companies with varying policies and plans.

8. It simplifies the whole system. It leads to higher economic productivity.

9. It promotes good health care for children, and treatments can be done at an initial state before they become chronic. Reduce the spread of infectious diseases.

10. It promotes self-employment and business startups, as people do not have to worry about health insurance.

11. Accounts receivable is a massive problem for doctors and hospitals today. With
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Raven2018

From: Raven2018

Sep-11

It's not a fair case, because (as I said in a prior post) they could have contracted Covid-19 on the way to the airport in a taxi, in an airport restaurant, gift shop, or restroom.

They cannot prove, that they contracted Covid-19 on the plane, from a flight attendant.

They could have contracted the virus from a fully vaccinated passenger, if it did occur on the plane.

MEDDLY

From: MEDDLY

Sep-11

<<<They could have contracted the virus from a fully vaccinated passenger, if it did occur on the plane.>>>

Yes, maybe a fully vaccinated person did infect a non vaccinated individual. Being vaccinated doesn't mean you cannot infect someone else, especially if you are carrying the virus in your clothes, unwashed hands, face, etc.

Raven2018

From: Raven2018

Sep-11

Jenifer (Zarknorph) said:

You skipped the other list...

******************

I read it, and posted the link to it.

IMO, the good does not outweigh the bad.

The good, the bad, and the ugly of England's universal

https://theweek.com/articles/789287/good-bad-ugly-englands-universal-healthcare-system

Jenifer (Zarknorph)
Host

From: Jenifer (Zarknorph)

Sep-12

Raven2018 said:

It's not a fair case, because (as I said in a prior post) they could have contracted Covid-19 on the way to the airport in a taxi, in an airport restaurant, gift shop, or restroom.

A single case, yes.  But if 40% or more of the people on a single flight test positive - that's a class action suit right there.

Raven2018

From: Raven2018

Sep-12

Jenifer (Zarknorph) said:

A single case, yes. But if 40% or more of the people on a single flight test positive - that's a class action suit right there.

**********************************

Covid-19, of course, is not going to show-up in a test the moment the passengers deplane.

The virus is not detected in the early stages, so you are not going to be able to prove that you contracted it on the plane no matter how many other passengers, also, test positive.

It may be very likely that it was contracted on the plane, but "likely" is not proof.

If it, actually, did happen on the plane there is no way to proves that it was contracted from the non-vaccinated flight attendant; as it could have easily been contracted by the vaccinated flight attendant.

Further, the virus may have been contracted by the viral organisms on a surface of the plane that was left by a passenger on the, prior, flight who sneezed/coughed, fiddled with their face mask, and did not wash/sanitized their hands.

"Unless you ask the person sitting next to you to buckle your seatbelt (which we don’t recommend) you’re going to touch that piece of metal at least twice during a flight, once before takeoff, and once when you land. Unfortunately, these oft-used items aren’t getting the spick and span treatment you’d like. According to Travelmath, the average airplane seatbelt buckle tested for 230 colony-forming units (CFU) per square inch. Yes, cabin cleaners do a wipe down of lavatories after an aircraft’s passengers have deplaned, but think about how many folks use the facilities during the flight and how many hours go by before that cleaning happens. In an interview with TIME, University of Arizona microbiologist Dr. Charles Gerba said, “It’s hard to beat the restroom because the water shuts off so people can’t complete hand washing. The sinks are so small that people with large hands can’t even fit them fully underneath the faucets.” A bathroom is a dangerous place–these are things you should never do in an airplane restroom. "    https://www.rd.com/list/things-airplanes-arent-cleaning-well/

There is no justifiable/provable reason, IMO, to charge a non-vaccinated person more than a vaccinate person for health insurance.

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