Military Guns and Ammunition

Hosted by gatnerd

This is intended for people interested in the subject of military guns and their ammunition, with emphasis on automatic weapons.

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NGSW evaluation update   Small Arms <20mm

Started 31/7/20 by autogun; 16844 views.

From: smg762


Why do all the NGSW  guns have suppressors, is the US planning on giving one to every grunt?

Also whats the energies of the 277 it about 2000ft  lbs like the 7mm-08?

 and wasnt the original LSAT goal to reduce weight vs 556....why did they go with 7mm ammo in 20 round mags?  Assuming the ammo is at least 15 grams, with a rifle thats 3.2kg or higher, thats a big weight increase. Should have gone with a 224 valkyrie.

  • Edited 18 January 2021 11:26  by  smg762

From: Farmplinker


I read someone (not a SIG employee) who claimed SIG was getting their weight reduction by comparing performance. A conventional brass cartridge would weigh x to achieve the performance specifications; our cartridge achieved the performance specifications at 20% less weight than x. Sounds plausible, anyway.


From: nincomp


I agree with Farmplinker.  I think that the 20% reduction that SIG talks about is vs a comparable cartridge like the 270 WSM.  One article I saw said that the existing round is about the same weight as 7.62x51.


From: nincomp


smg762 said...

Also whats the energies of the 277 it about 2000ft  lbs like the 7mm-08?

No, considerably more. We have seen numbers of 3000fps with a 135 grain bullet, so closer to 2700ft-lbs, which makes it more like a 270 WSM.  The goal is to penetrate hard body armor at several hundred meters, 600 iirc.  It is to have a suppressor.  As near as I can tell, other goals included less recoil than a .22 rimfire, lighter weight than the average feather, and the abilities to tie the soldiers boots and walk the General's dog.  

  • Edited 18 January 2021 12:52  by  nincomp

From: renatohm


USMC is already transitioning to widespread use of suppressors, so it's not surprising that Army could follow suit.


From: autogun


gatnerd said:

SIG's base is Stainless Steel, then the body of the case is brass.

I should know better than to rely on my memory these days... rage

In reply toRe: msg 107

From: stancrist


True Velocity Ammo: 6.8 TVCM Composite-Cased Ammo

Ever seen a composite-cased ammo full-auto pew fest? Neither have we...until now. Enter True Velocity. RECOILtv is now supported on all of your favorite plat...


From: Red7272


I remember thinking that Emeric's neckless polymer case from a decade or so ago was the way to go and seeing it realised I still think that. Enough in common with existing designs to not frighten the conservatives (like me) and a significant improvement in performance. 


From: gatnerd


Great find Stan.

So that seems to confirm that the TV 6.8 can be pretty easily adapted to existing 7.62 weapons. 

That is can be adapted to the lightweight, Constant Recoil KAC AMG is especially promising.

Assuming weapon and cartridge perform as good as they look, that would be a hell of a combination. 

In reply toRe: msg 110

From: gatnerd


Well its confirmed.

SIG's "20% lighter" is lawyering the contract; 23% lighter then .270 WSM brass...

  • Edited 27 January 2021 11:20  by  gatnerd