Military Guns and Ammunition
Hosted by gatnerd
This is intended for people interested in the subject of military guns and their ammunition, with emphasis on automatic weapons.
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Poland deploying LMP-2017 60mm Commando Mortars Army Guns 20+mm
From: Refleks
27/10/21
I'm a fan. I think commando mortars are a good complement to GPMG teams at platoon level, especially if everyone is carrying a few rounds anyway for the company.
From: gatnerd
27/10/21
Refleks said:I'm a fan. I think commando mortars are a good complement to GPMG teams at platoon level, especially if everyone is carrying a few rounds anyway for the company
Absolutely.
One of the things I had thought about with regards to 6.8 NGSW is that if each squad has 1-2x 6.8 LMG's (which likely outdistance the legacy m240) then the future 'weapons squad' that was previously devoted to M240's could be switched to a more HE-centric capability such as deploying Commando Mortars and/or Carl Gustaf's.
From: Mr. T (MrT4)
27/10/21
Years ago i got to handle the Czech original and fire some practice rounds . Looking at the upgrade with larger frame i can imagine that weight grew somewhat.
- Edited 27 October 2021 5:50 by Mr. T (MrT4)
From: gatnerd
27/10/21
Mr. T (MrT4) said:Years ago i got to handle the Czech original and fire some practice rounds .
Very cool! Not too many people I imagine have that experience.
How did you find aiming? Does it seem like something that would be capable of firing fairly accurately?
From: gatnerd
27/10/21
Some info on the standard polish O-LM60 round that the LMP-2017 fires.
2kg shell, 1500+ fragments, 15m lethal radius.
And from a Polish wikipedia:
The basic O-LM60 grenade exceeds the weight of similar foreign missiles and is characterized by a high density of shrapnel coverage [1] . Between the explosive (TNT) and the shell, fragmenting into approx. 300 pieces, there are 1500 steel balls, 4 mm in diameter, embedded in plastic, which increase the fragmentation effect [1] . The ammunition is not compatible with NATO standard ammunition (60.7 mm mortars) [1] .
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/60_mm_mo%C5%BAdzierz_LM-60D
Further confirmation would be cool if the mortar does indeed use a pre-fragmented design. If so, thats not as perfect as the SAAB MAPAM, but is superior in design to a traditional cast iron mortar shell.
For example this Bulgarian mortar shell designed for Commando mortars reps having 600 fragments:
https://bulcomersks.com/military-products/ammunition/mortar-rounds/60mm-mortar-round-ar-m60-6/
Not sure how other 60mm's compare.
From: renatohm
27/10/21
15m kill radius and 2.3 km range.
Pin them down at 1 km with NGSW then send some 60 mm mortars on them.
Sounds nice on the right end, and very bad to be on the receiving end.
From: renatohm
27/10/21
Brazil still uses the legacy 13 kg Brandt mortar, even at 8 kg this one would save enough weight to get two additional rounds.
From: gatnerd
27/10/21
renatohm said:Pin them down at 1 km with NGSW then send some 60 mm mortars on them.
Absolutely. That was broadly my idea for dealing with body armor - focus on lightweight FA weapons to pin down enemy troops, and then use Squad and Platoon level HE to take them out.
In terms of launcher and shell weight, thats a great point that the lighter mortar = more shells.
60mm is nice in that it offers a good bang to weight ratio:
LMP-2017 = 16.53lbs
60mm Shell = 4.4lbs
x5 = 22lbs
=38.53lbs for LMP + 5x rounds
Carl Gustav M4= 14.55lbs
Aimpoint FCS13RE = 3.53lbs
HE 441D Airburst = 6.83lbs
x3= 20.5lbs
= 38.53lbs for M4 CG w/ FCU + 3x rounds
So vs the CG, you also gain +2 shells. Although the CG is almost certainly more accurate.
From: RovingPedant
27/10/21
I’d hazard that the mortar throws a greater proportion of its round weight at the enemy too.
From: Mr. T (MrT4)
27/10/21
Honestly felt good enough for 'hand held' use , but would never consider it if they also had a bipod for more stabilty. Can't imagine accurate fires at 1000m