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Military Guns and Ammunition

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This is intended for people interested in the subject of military guns and their ammunition, with emphasis on automatic weapons.

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Early tank APDS   General Military Discussion

Started 28-Jan by smg762; 1911 views.
smg762

From: smg762

28-Jan

Does anyone know the details of early post war tank APDS rounds?

Was it just something like a 30mms tungsten bullet in a giant 105mm sabot?

Were they effective or accurate?

In reply toRe: msg 1
schnuersi

From: schnuersi

28-Jan

For starters 105 mm tank guns are hardly early post war. These came into use in the '60.

The British 20 pdr would be an early post war ( ~'48) gun that used APDS as primary AP.

Yes basically its a large bullet shaped tungsten slug in a sabot. But they are more in the 50-60 mm diameter range.
I found a nice picture with minimal use of google:

These where effective and accurate.

  • Edited 28 January 2022 11:43  by  schnuersi
TonyDiG

From: TonyDiG

28-Jan

I was this years old when I learned that another term for a set screw is a grub screw.  Thank you. :)

schnuersi

From: schnuersi

28-Jan

You are welcome.

I have to admit I did not pay to much attention on the designation of the parts.

As funny side note: the term for this kind of screw is basically the same. Literally it would be thread grub "Gewindemade" but this term is used an understood. I learned it when I was still young. Allthough in engineering school I later learned that this was not the official term but the one craftsman and metalworkers use. For engineers its a "Gewindestift" wich translates to treaded pin. In the case above a slotted, threaded pin with point.

smg762

From: smg762

28-Jan

What's the projo diameter on modern 30mms apds? And what about apfsds?

Also are the Sabots on APDS 30mms just as heavy as the bullet? Thanks

In reply toRe: msg 5
schnuersi

From: schnuersi

28-Jan

There is little official data publicly available.
It depends on wich ammo design and which manufacturer. They can differ quite substancially.
There are some pictures that are easy to find with google showing a penetrator and a tape measure for scale. You can guess the diameter from them.

30 x 173 mm APDS penetrator most likely will be in the 15 mm diameter range. With APFSDS long rod type penetrators in the 10 mm range. Not much below.

The sabots are conciderably lighter than the projectiles. Modern medium caliber sabots are often made from plastics and weight only a couple of grams. Even the older aluminum ones where much lighter than the projectiles.

DavidPawley

From: DavidPawley

29-Jan

Technically, a set screw is a bolt with threads extending all the way to the head, contrasting with the unthreaded shank on a bolt.

Grub screws differ from set screws by being headless, but nobody actually cares about the difference in practice.

Except my woodwork and technical drawing teacher, Ken Reddell. He cared very much about that type of technicality. For instance, calling a drill a drill bit was grounds for dry ridicule. He would remind the whole class that it was either a drill or a bit and couldn’t be both. Despite this (or because) he was a well liked teacher.

smg762

From: smg762

29-Jan

2 grams? Surely the Sabot is more than 30 grains

In reply toRe: msg 8
ZailC

From: ZailC

29-Jan

Yes, two grams is a bit low. 30mm APDS and APFSDS sabots are from 10 to twenty grams. Way less than the mass of either the propellant gases or the tungsten projectile.

JPeelen

From: JPeelen

29-Jan

"A couple of grams", as schnuersi wrote, is by no means "2 grams" but has the meaning of "several" grams.  

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