gatnerd

Military Guns and Ammunition

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This is intended for people interested in the subject of military guns and their ammunition, with emphasis on automatic weapons.

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Ukraine weapons thread   General Military Discussion

Started 24/2/22 by gatnerd; 182626 views.
stancrist

From: stancrist

17/5/22

gatnerd said:

T90M - one of Russias most modern tanks - disabled/damaged by a Carl Gustaf 84mm.

The Tank is then destroyed by a (claimed) 30F26 125mm HE-FRAG, which despite being an anti personnel round is able to destroy the tank with a rearward hit.

Its being debated whether UA fired the 125mm shot, or if it was RU destroying the T90M to prevent its capture.

Another analysis of this action:

Russia Lost Their BEST Tank - The Truth

Many of you are probably aware that Russia lost the T-90M tank, which is currently the most modern tank in their arsenal. This is kind of a big deal because,...

Mr. T (MrT4)

From: Mr. T (MrT4)

18/5/22

Anyone who has ever seen towed howitzer fires , setup and move , very slow to shoot and scoot .

M777 on the receiving end of MLRS fires , question is what is the first projectile while they are still in firing position from? Its a bit large for a drone bomblet

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjB-nmG51gM

schnuersi

From: schnuersi

18/5/22

Mr. T (MrT4) said:

Anyone who has ever seen towed howitzer fires , setup and move , very slow to shoot and scoot .

If spotted in real time regardless if by drone, FO, aircraft or whatevery the setup time and shoot and scoot matters little. Under this conditions artillery is perfectly capable of hitting moving targets.
Shoot and scoot matters if indirect measures of detection are used.

taschoene

From: taschoene

18/5/22

Mr. T (MrT4) said:

question is what is the first projectile while they are still in firing position from? Its a bit large for a drone bomblet

Reported as a KUB-BLA loitering munition.

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1526878044505481218

stancrist

From: stancrist

19/5/22

Something that I find surprising about this war is the number of videos showing a "lone wolf" Russian tank running around.

No wing man.  No infantry support.  It's as if they intend to provide Ukrainian ATGM gunners with some easy target practice.

Ukraine forces unit fire anti-tank missiles at a Russian T-80BVM tank in Kharkiv

Aerial video released on May 18 by a Ukrainian military unit operating in Kharkiv shows Ukrainian troops firing anti-tank weapons at a Russian T-80BVM tank n...

gatnerd

From: gatnerd

19/5/22

stancrist said:

Something that I find surprising about this war is the number of videos showing a "lone wolf" Russian tank running around

On the sprawling thread on Arfcom on the subject, the lone tank phenomenon has also been a frequent source of puzzlement. Several (possibly overlapping) theories have come up

-Difficulties of communication / organization on the Russian side due to Generals/high ranking orginization being targeted + generally uneven distribution of secure radios (we've seen RU units using $20 boefang walkie talkies that are being picked up by HAM radio operators)

-Random RU troops just deciding to go on solo Tank rampages in the absence of clear directives to the contrary, or units getting lost and ending up in tank fights

-Survivors bias - video where ATGMs were successful and the operator lived to share the video occur primarily in the presence of a single tank

-Wide battlefront plus heavy losses result in large # of incidents of only a single tank being in a given area

schnuersi

From: schnuersi

20/5/22

stancrist said:

Something that I find surprising about this war is the number of videos showing a "lone wolf" Russian tank running around. No wing man. No infantry support. It's as if they intend to provide Ukrainian ATGM gunners with some easy target practice.

In most videos the conclusion that the tank shown is a lone wolf can not be drawn.
In the fist part of the the video linked, the first 40 seconds, the area shown is too small. Tanks under combat conditions are usually more than 50 m appart. More than 100 m in open country are not uncommon. Most videos i have seen don't show large areas. They are zoomed in and focus on one vehicle.

What I find much stranger is the obvious reluctance to pop smoke or use the coax. The tanks only ever seem to use their main gun. Not even MG fire between the gun shots to achieve supression. No hosing of treelines with .30 or .50 cal fire. etc
The tanks are often rather static, rarely fire from the move and stick to the roads. Even when under attack. Which makes little sense.
All of this is in direct conflict to common best practice even 101 for tankers.

The second part of the video is especially distrubing. The tank is under attack. Obiously the crew realised that. But instead of immediately leaving the road at full speed and get distance to the anti tank team they start to play cat and mouse. The correct reaction would be to smoke, hose the bushes with MG fire while disengaging at max speed and once at a safe distance call for a fire misson so the entire area gets liberally dozed with ICM or airburst HE.
What you don't do ever is to fight close combat against infantry anti tank teams. Not in 1916, not in 1943, not in 1973, not in 2003 and certainly not nowadays.

Mr. T (MrT4)

From: Mr. T (MrT4)

20/5/22

Like Schnuersi suggested , much of it might be down to how footage is taken  

Unless tanks are marching bunched together.

Here you basically lose a  tank because they are in way of each other

And its always hard to see any infantry in these videos but its obviously present.

Or when you are bottlenecked to cross a pontoon, you can end up with lots of wrecks from the artillery barrage.

Farmplinker

From: Farmplinker

20/5/22

"Yuri, you're on the right flank". Wouldn't be surprised if these are temporarily out of sight of the rest of the unit. They get popped, and the Ukrainians retreat.

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