gatnerd

Military Guns and Ammunition

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This is intended for people interested in the subject of military guns and their ammunition, with emphasis on automatic weapons.

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NGSW Phase 2 Consolidation and info   Small Arms <20mm

Started 30/8/19 by gatnerd; 477593 views.
DavidPawley

From: DavidPawley

8/9/21

And as we can see, the bolt carrier only travels far enough rearward for the rammer to align with the base of the next cartridge.

roguetechie

From: roguetechie

8/9/21

The tkb-022pm wasn't an AK prototype and no it's not a rising chamber Design.

It uses a falling breechblock and rammer design which is very ingenious.

Max actually has a YouTube video with a very accurate 3d model of it's internal workings.

The gun is pure genius in so many ways though not particularly practical or large scale producible.

Red7272

From: Red7272

9/9/21

roguetechie said:

The gun is pure genius in so many ways though not particularly practical or large scale producible.

I've always thought it was the solution to all the issues with a bullpup, but it is just a little too complex to be soldier proof. I imagine now it could be made cost effectively with CNCs and investment casting but even so that would be the only issue in it's way - beyond the unnatural bias against bullpups. 

stancrist

From: stancrist

9/9/21

Red7272 said:

I've always thought it was the solution to all the issues with a bullpup

I'm curious how you reached that conclusion.  Have you handled or fired one?   Because it looks to me like the TKB-022 has most of the usual bullpup issues (e.g., poor balance and handling, excessive length of pull, etc.) and more.

With the extreme rearward location of the magazine, weapon handling and mag changes while wearing body armor and load bearing gear seem likely to be problematical.

Red7272

From: Red7272

9/9/21

stancrist said:

With the extreme rearward location of the magazine, weapon handling and mag changes while wearing body armor and load bearing gear seem likely to be problematical.

So moved the controls back and add a 20 cm telescoping butt. all the issues with a bullpup solved. 

smg762

From: smg762

9/9/21

The current world record for .22s is only about 2300 ft lbs. Step up to 6mm and the record was 3500lbs....from the 243 H&H magnum.   The main proble  would be throat wear. Thats why i think you could add tiny bore-riding fins onto the bearing surface of a .22. Briging it up to 6mm...

With polygonal or radial rifling, the fins might be viable.

  • Edited 09 September 2021 9:16  by  smg762
stancrist

From: stancrist

9/9/21

Red7272 said:

So moved the controls back and add a 20 cm telescoping butt. all the issues with a bullpup solved.

The way the control group is attached to the barrel, it looks to me like the controls cannot be moved back even 1 cm, let alone 20.  https://youtu.be/J5x_clmnUjo?t=30

roguetechie

From: roguetechie

9/9/21

I've always really wanted one. 16" bbl and almost 21" length sounds utterly awesome!

After seeing Max's video of the internals you'd definitely need to do very high quality stampings and CNC welding for many of the parts just because of how the mechanism is. 

I think it would be hard to impossible to do it without lots of stampings and precision welds, at least if you want a reasonable weight of end product.

It's a very cool design and I'd personally treasure a repro beyond any other gun I could possibly get!

It'd probably cost $10k each these days though lol.

roguetechie

From: roguetechie

9/9/21

The LOP looks pretty reasonable to me tbh.

A lot of people seem to think the tkb-022pm is bigger than it is for some reason but the gun is quite tiny. Here's two pictures which should help. It appears to come to a little past the crook of the one guy's elbow in the first pic.

smg762

From: smg762

9/9/21

Seems like the ACR is almost as length efficient. Which do u think would be most reliable and which would work best with CT ammo

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