This is intended for people interested in the subject of military guns and their ammunition, with emphasis on automatic weapons.
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taschoene said: Or the Poles get Challenger 2 and give up their last T-72s.
Or they get more Leos or M1s.
The actual deal being proposed is that the UK will provide Challenger 2 to Poland and Poland will deliver their T-72s to Ukraine. Poland already has Leo2 and has ordered M1A2 SEP V3.
that's been clarified. UK troops with challengers as a stopgap
...and a few lines above the statement of one week General Laubenthal states "extensive training" is needed. I know Gen. Laubenthal personally. More than 20 years ago he was my company commander. He served in the armored corps, is a tanker and generally a very good officer and leader.
If a paratrooper with no experience with AFV claims he knows better I have serious doubts.
Even more so since these claims are conflicting with my experience. An AFV is not a new rifle.
I am aware of the claims that its all not a big deal and in one or two weeks the Ukraine can field brigades with Marders and Leopards. Which in my experience and knowledge is simply a load of crap. Most likely politically motivated. Yes, Ukraine needs help but we need to face the sad reality that what was fucked up over at least the last decade can not be undone in weeks.
For example i know that the vehicles we are talking about are not anywhere near ready to use. I actually have seen them some time ago. I also was part of a Leopard crew and did train crews for several years. I have an engineering background and now work for the MoD. It can not realisitically be done. Most likely taking the current supply situation into account it would take at least half a year. This IMHO should be done or at least tried. But that is above my paygrade.
Germany is supplying heavy weapons just indirectly,many of the east European T72 clones are being supplied in exchange for surplus german Marders and Fuchs or whatever deals can be made on the purchase of Boxers.
yeah, long term that will not be sufficient. I am assuming @Schnuersi and colleagues are currently looking into Leo and Marder stocks and refurbishing them. As are their counterparts in the Pentagon
Thanks, I had not seen that clarification about Challenger 2 to Poland. British Army of the Vistula, then?
Somewhat surprised at how low the CV90MK4 is in comparison to Lynx and Ascod , also that maned turret seems to be the choice for Czech and Slovaks given the internal volume
Maybe they see manned turrets as simpler / less expensive?
They are simpler and less expensive.
Not every military is convinced on the viability of unmanned turrets.
If the advantages are not (fully) applicable to a given use it makes little sense to spend the adiitional resources an advantages of a manned turret.