Horse Racing Forum

Hosted by Cindy Dulay (CindyDulay)|Horse-Races.Net

This is a place for friendly and civil discussion of horse racing of all types including handicapping.

  • 526
  • 31788
  • 28


Kentucky Derby 2021 DogsUp Diary   Triple Crown

Started 2/28/21 by DogsUp; 72155 views.
In reply toRe: msg 434

From: DogsUp


Whether the evidence is mishandled or never submitted, that evidence is then lost and inadmissible to courts for further testing. Once the evidence is contaminated or kept hidden, there is no bringing it back to be used.

My calculation is Baffert attorneys will seek *may have already served notice of intent to sue; from Churchill, NYRA and KY Commission: $500 $500 $500 mil.

LLOOTAH dog bones.

In reply toRe: msg 435

From: DogsUp


Breeders Cup folks and Bob Baffert will have a pow wow over his eligibility one way or another. 

If they allow Bob to run; a very high indication they know Bob is going after NYRA and Churchie for due process and liable/reputation and livelihood. 

I say Bob is IN.

  • Edited September 19, 2021 11:26 pm  by  DogsUp
In reply toRe: msg 436

From: DogsUp


There's no reading between the lines. 

As to NY State law where issues are at hand; not NY State Racing commission Tbred racing rules...

NYRA is in the hot seat. And their second salvo in barring Baffert from racing has created this situation under N Y State law.

And over to Churchill Downs; how does a prominent, experienced plant install video racing slots later to discover illegal,and now, have to deal out to players $140 mil in recovery.

In reply toRe: msg 437

From: DogsUp


For whatever reasons;  the Thoroughbred race tracks of NYRA and C D are not thorough when taking actions beyond the jurisdictional administrative rules of racing.


From: princeofdoc


You may be right, Dogs.....but as of now, Derby points are still being withheld from Baffert will be tested this weekend as the first points race out west happens at Santa Anita in the American Pharoah on opening day


From: DogsUp


What happens..if Baffert say wins (in a Derby 2022 point race);  those points are not moved to the remaining place finishers. As redistributed.

If Baffert prevails in 'civil court in KY those  point credits will or would become valid for Baffert horses Derby point entry. And if still barred by Kdy Derby/Commonwealth racing commision for entry, it takes on Baffert suing Derby/Church for disregard of court findings and the adjudication.

Could cover a few runners..

And to add to the 'My Old Kentucky Moan Saga' possibilities of a case of  those othet 'non-Baffert trained runners closing in on  point races for the top 20 point posts waiting on Baffert reinstatement and getting bumped. 

We'll see Baffert Breeders Cup qualified horses in respective race(s) this year. Otherwise, if Baffert is barred in this 2021 BC and legally prevails in his court suit thereafter, their/BC civil suit awards to Baffert would come costly.

Baffert has not had a drug charge in 6 months prior to the Derby. There are rules of intentional vs unintentional drug administration. This Derby DQ case and the drug is surface ointment not an injection or milk shake type oral entry to a horse. 

I wonder what other trainers and owners think the outcome  should be? As to this precident setting case?

The John Doe racing public is way past the KY 2021 two minutes.

It's perhaps 1/9 that trainers of Pletcher/Mott/Shug/Chad stature would ever weigh in before any outcome. And that is quite evident. Yet I have my own  guess that they do not want an 'AM workout restraining rein' on them causal to the court outcome if not in favor of Baffert.

A guess of trainers' perspectives whereas an unintentional and nature of drug. Horse wins (can't turn back Official*) no purse award, and substantial fine. 

About bettors involvement

*Once Official..even discovered wrongly, all tickets/bets shall forever be final.  Like Saratoga Alamouse incident..DQd wrong horse. I was there. Live crowd booed at DQ in this 2021 Derby and went home with a non cashable souvenir ticket.

In this case 1 Stewart fired, 1 retired. One moved to Finger Lakes track. All tickets final.


  • Edited September 29, 2021 3:25 pm  by  DogsUp

From: Wintertrian


DogsUp said...

Baffert has not had a drug charge in 6 months prior to the Derby. There are rules of intentional vs unintentional drug administration. 



Baffert's horses were cited for drug-related violations 29 times, according to the ARCI.  According to Baffert, these violations are ALL unintentional, despite that the excuses he dreams up are always quite bizarre.   

Basically he will just take you to court for even suggesting he's guilty of anything, and sue you for court costs.   Just hand him a hypodermic and leave him alone already!    

Not that U.S. Racing has anything at all to be embarassed about {sarcasm}:

His recent comment:  “I’ve learned who my friends are.”

Well Bob, the horses you drugged, killed, or sent to the breeding shed lame aren't your friends.   Either is anyone who cares about them, and that includes me.

But I do like Medina Spirit, the horse,  and will keep you and him separated in my mind and heart for sure. 

In reply toRe: msg 440

From: DogsUp


whoa! Horsie....

RE: A State or Commonwealth racing commision does establish, codify rules... yet these are authorities, not employees of the State.

Their perview does not take them to/beyond civil or criminal charges or prosecution.

  • Edited October 6, 2021 6:18 pm  by  DogsUp
In reply toRe: msg 442

From: DogsUp


I really doubt any of our horse peeps here will be facing criminal charges or substantial penalty civil court proceedings.

But if one does; they will have their attorney seek every possible due process available.

From this outdoor dog house Dogs sees the 2 tracks recently suspending Baffert as an attempt to note their ruling on this unintentional medication; in that in that Baffert is found not complicit (unintentional medication ...and lack of due process.

The  Commonwealth has simply become complicent in the evidence they present  to courts whereas, not admissible, due to their part in contamination of 2nd sample.

  • Edited October 17, 2021 2:31 am  by  DogsUp

From: ChiefsCrown


Off topic....Just read 3X Gr. 1 winning Lord Nelson was euthanized due to a lengthy bout with laminitis at Spendthrift Farm. Another taken too soon from that equine scourge.