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Fla Derby   Triple Crown

Started 3/21/21 by Plus2lbs; 3735 views.

From: Gerh


It seems like every year Baffert produces the same type of runner regardless of pedigree.The numerous drug infractions are bad enough but the BS excuses offered by Baffert are ridiculous.But you are right;Baffert has not ruined the purity of the sport.Thoroughbred racing,through its inaction and complacency has already done that

In reply toRe: msg 33

From: Plus2lbs


Scapegoats don't cut it.


In reply toRe: msg 33

From: princeofdoc


First of all, virtually all trainers use Lasix unless they can't due to rules; BB is no outlier there.  Does he include illegal drugs as well, that are masked by Lasix?  Perhaps.  He has been called out, but so have others.  True, the whole sport needs greater accountability, no doubt. 

But it's a completely other charge that BB (or anyone) can somehow create a Derby winner out of a horse without a good pedigree, without good preparation, and without superior athletic ability. 

I just don't buy it


From: ChiefsCrown


Thanks for the kudos on Known Agenda win. I think he'll be live longer (+10/1) shot in the derby. Reminds me of Pletcher's Super Saver from 2010.

Think any of the Jack Ruby Steaks runners have a legit shot of hitting the board in the derby?

In reply toRe: msg 33

From: Wintertrian


Gerh said...

It seems like every year Baffert produces the same type of runner regardless of pedigree.

At least someone notices. 


From: Wintertrian


princeofdoc said...

virtually all trainers use Lasix unless they can't due to rules; BB is no outlier there.  Does he include illegal drugs as well, that are masked by Lasix?  Perhaps.  He has been called out, but so have others.

Yeah, okay.   And Im not talking about lasix although that is certainly part of the US problem.

Not just called out.........he had an entire racing board have a meeting, behind closed doors, to throw out one of his positives.  

And nobody said he creates derby winners out of horses w/out good pedigrees.   

Really, it's like most of what I'm talking about has gone over your head, but that's okay.  You don't have to "buy it".    ;)  

I guess you don't remember when roman dropped out the the game........ever wonder why?   Did you even read why?   Its when you have a numbers theory and the subject matter no longer runs to those numbers.  Every wonder why THAT is?   It's because of pervasive drugs.  You can't very well have a numbers theory if the numbers go all wonky because they no longer *fit* any scenario....

In reply toRe: msg 33
SameSteve G

From: SameSteve G


Gerh said:

Baffert has not ruined the purity of the sport. Thoroughbred racing, through its inaction and complacency has already done that.

Bingo!  Exactly right.  

In reply toRe: msg 39

From: Wintertrian


Yes Gerh you are correct, they have allowed the transgressions.   

I  think they are convinced that racing needs Bafferts, and Servis et. al. without realizing for the serious and longstanding fans, it's making them walk away. 

Maybe the newbie younger generation will love all the Baffert hype as they are used to all that from instagram, tiktok, etc. which is all about hype hype hype, superstardom, influencers, etc.   I've no stomach for it myself. I find all that self-promotion and posing to be quite boring.  I think most thinking adults do.  

I would love for the industry to embrace more of the hard working long timers who have been toiling away in smaller barns giving 110% 24/7 but there seems to be no place for them in the game of billionaire big barns and their connections.    I know it was once called the Sport of Kings but even that is getting a little long in the tooth because that always implied that you had to be a king to even participate in this sport, at any level like one of those Dream The Impossible Dream scenarios and lottery winners.     I just don't think that is a truism and certainly not reallly fitting in in a more modern society as we move into 2021 and beyond. 

I'm actually suprised the Bezos doesn't own race horses yet.   I mean, it would be fitting. :)  



From: Wintertrian


princeofdoc said...

To be honest, I never really understood the comment "doesn't have to win" in the Derby preps.....sure, he'll still qualify if he doesn't win, but why would he not run his best?  

Well if you believe that a horse is entered in every race  for a win (esp. if they don't need one) then you have not examined all the intents of the trainer. 

In this case it is very possible that the trainer may have wanted his horse to eat some dirt and that lesson was more important for his future at Chuchill than a win in the FL Derby.   

Sometimes horses are entered in races for tighteners, sometimes for education, etc.    This is why trainer intent always has to be considered when capping a race.  

Meanwhile. I thought this was a good prep race.  I think Soup and Sandwich is no slouch and I had picked Known Agenda to win because of his stamina breeding.......   So I am thrilled to see them make the gate.    


From: DogsUp


The JR top 2 placers, add weight, distance/a Derby furlong + Dirt surface don't seem to be high contenders.

More importantly we saw 3 top contenders in the Flow Derby not get the 9 fl. Doubt they can get 10fl come what 'May. 

And those winner/finishers in Flow Derby may be sitting on a bounce 'backwards come May 1. Especially Soup + go. The race was not exactly full of high credentials/PP and jocks made the difference IMO.

Don't think Spielberg (this race + prior an also ran) or G-Honor (running style established) Collaborate (running against better colts) got anything out of the race except that these colts get off the board at a mile and a furlong. Or at least the Rose win.

Snow here. But we have had T shirt shorts weather already. 

  • Edited March 29, 2021 1:07 pm  by  DogsUp