Atrocities -  Running Wolf????? (256 views) Notify me whenever anyone posts in this discussion.Subscribe
 
From: Tess Lone Elk (TessLoneElk)4/17/01 11:06 AM 
To: All  (1 of 81) 
 887.1 
Was in a conversation over the weekend re: a woman (white) who says she atteneded a "medicine pipe ceremony" in the Los Angeles area of a Cherokee "Shaman" who is the only "authorized" shaman by the US Government to "teach" Cherokee Medicine Way.....?????????

I asked her to make me a copy of the "flyer" she got. I take an Archaeology class with her, and I think she is planning to pass the flyers out today....I am going to talk to the Prof. and ask him not to do that, at least until I ask around and check this out....

Anyone know of the person??? Running Wolf???

TESS

Edited after I found this web site.
http://www.gadohi.org/


Edited 4/17/01 11:14:04 AM ET by TESSLONEELK
 
 Reply   Options 

 
From: Guest4/17/01 11:33 AM 
To: Tess Lone Elk (TessLoneElk)  (2 of 81) 
 887.2 in reply to 887.1 
Hey Tess,
I never heard of this guy.. took a look at the site and well.. kinda vague IMHO.. maybe Mike or someone has heard of him?? Thanks for posting the info.
Click here for some of the current headlines!
Host of
Rising From the Ruins
&
The Stronghold
Check out Native Community Radio
 

 
From: Rebekah Morrigan (bizidaam)4/17/01 8:03 PM 
To: Tess Lone Elk (TessLoneElk)  (3 of 81) 
 887.3 in reply to 887.1 
Yeah, I think he'd better be "running" all right... I'm sorry, but "VENERABLE"??? "ORDAINED"??? These are Cherokee terms??? I may not know nuttin' about Cherokee ways, but I find it really hard to believe that these are terms that would be used by ANY traditional Indians. Tibetan Buddhist monks, yes, but a "medicince man"???

And since WHEN does the U.S. government have ANY say on who's an "authorized shaman"??? Never mind the fact that there ARE no "shamans" in Cherokee spiritual traditions -- and I can say this with confidence having read an official statement from the CNO that says exactly this very thing. (if I can find the URL for it, I'll post it)

The only true measure of this guy's "authenticity" lies with his own people, and them alone. Heck, I know enough stuff, I could set up my OWN non-profit organization, proclaim myself a "spiritual leader", and gather a bunch of spiritually starved people around me and impress the heck outta them. Would I have any standing with any Nation? No way -- but I could probably fool alot of folks into thinking that I did.

It's not that he isn't maybe teaching some good spiritual stuff to people who might need it -- but NO Indian "spiritual leader" that I'VE ever met has EVER publicly proclaimed him/ or her/self as such. They are known to their people, and anyone else who is able to find their way to them can do so only because they have received the peoples' acceptance and the blessings of the spirits to be able to make that connection.

Just my own take on this...

Reba



Forum Host:

Indian Country Perspectives
Native discussion on Native issues.

 

 
From: Guest4/17/01 8:14 PM 
To: Rebekah Morrigan (bizidaam)  (4 of 81) 
 887.4 in reply to 887.3 
 

 
From: Rebekah Morrigan (bizidaam)4/17/01 8:21 PM 
To: Tess Lone Elk (TessLoneElk)  (5 of 81) 
 887.5 in reply to 887.3 
Found 'em, those statements, which were written in response to questions about another "Cherokee Shaman":

See: http://pluto.beseen.com/boardroom/a/50877/View?n=00281
>> Our nation does not recognize shamans. We have no priesthood. Traditional families pass down knowledge of healing medicines to relatives.<<

From: Mike Miller,
Cherokee Council Member
Director of Communications
Cherokee Nation

And: http://pluto.beseen.com/boardroom/a/50877/View?n=00305
>>...a "Cherokee Shaman," or a "Cherokee Pipe carrier" none of which actually exist or ever have.<<

>>Cherokee medicine people and spiritual leaders are known to the Cherokee people and do not practice medicine for a fee nor sell "shamanic" lessons to anyone. They do not advertise their services through any form of media and certainly not over the internet.<<

>>Our traditional Cherokee healers and spiritual leaders are humble people and would not present themselves as such nor "hang out a shingle" so to speak. Cherokee medicine people are acknowledged and recognized by members of the Cherokee community as effective healers and leaders. It is the recognition of the Cherokee people that validates these persons as medicine people and healers not self-proclaimation.<<

From: Richard L. Allen. EdD
Research & Policy Analyst
Cherokee Nation



Forum Host:

Indian Country Perspectives
Native discussion on Native issues.

 

 
From: Rebekah Morrigan (bizidaam)4/17/01 8:32 PM 
To: Guest  (6 of 81) 
 887.6 in reply to 887.4 
Well, I think the statements I just posted pretty much say it all.

I just really STRONGLY DISLIKE seeing Indian spiritual ways being commodified by self-aggrandizing phonies, who know damn well that there's so many clueless lost souls out there that they are GUARANTEED a faithful following of ignorant non-Indians.

I KNOW how hard it is to get to the REAL thing... And it AIN'T about taking a bunch of classes...

PFFAAWW!!!

BW ;(



Forum Host:

Indian Country Perspectives
Native discussion on Native issues.

 

 
From: Guest4/17/01 9:00 PM 
To: Rebekah Morrigan (bizidaam)  (7 of 81) 
 887.7 in reply to 887.6 
<<I KNOW how hard it is to get to the REAL thing... And it AIN'T about taking a bunch of classes... >>
That is way too true! but when you do find it.. it is worth all the blood, sweat and tears spent in the journey and that journey has its own lessons too..

<<I just really STRONGLY DISLIKE seeing Indian spiritual ways being commodified by self-aggrandizing phonies, who know damn well that there's so many clueless lost souls out there that they are GUARANTEED a faithful following of ignorant non-Indians. >>

and the world seems to be full of them these days now that it is "cool to be ndn" eh.. ggggggeeeeeeeezzzzzzzzz but am getting offa here for tonight LMAO.. will post more tommorrow


Click here for some of the current headlines!
Host of
Rising From the Ruins
&
The Stronghold
Check out Native Community Radio
 

 
From: Mike (stormstudio) DelphiPlus Member Icon4/18/01 12:28 PM 
To: Rebekah Morrigan (bizidaam)  (8 of 81) 
 887.8 in reply to 887.3 
You're right. 'Venerable' is a term adapted to suit the prestige factor of these kinds of people.

Take a look at the photo of the man. Now, true we're one of the most mixed peoples around, which is both to our benefit and detriment. Many fullbloods, but it's not too rare to see one as 'white' as this be in a position of government, even be in a spiritual position of some sort. I know of a mixed man who is dedicated to the old pre-Christian ways, practices it accurately and shows how these things are done - fortunately his great-grand was a known ada'wehi - "priest" is the closest term in english but still is incorrect - and he acquired much of the knowledge through the family. There should be more Ani Yun'wiya like my friend - for all that remains, so much has been forgotten about.

But that's not what this man is doing. He's teaching 'Native American Spirituality'. You know that, beyond the wheel, certain herbs, and the earth & it's animal relatives, everything else is different & specific to peoples. There's no way to present an in-depth course based under this false banner - one might as well pull out the ol' animal totem cards and forget about it.

Says he's somehow associated with the late Rolling Thunder. I've spoken a couple times to Thunder's daughter, and it'd be good to reconnect again, so at some point I'll ask what she might know about the person.

But it's pretty clearcut. Way out away from the people he claims. Near Taos, real people there but also known haven of spiritual fanatics. Doing a pan-Indian crash course. Advertising with the website...

It's that Royalty vs. Loyalty thing again. Wonder what the 'Honorable Oukah' would have to say about it:|

Best,

Mike

All Natives Forum

NHIC Humor Forum

"Support Your Local Indigenous Inhabitant"



Edited 4/18/01 8:33:06 PM ET by STORMSTUDIO
 

 
From: Rebekah Morrigan (bizidaam)4/18/01 6:39 PM 
To: Mike (stormstudio) DelphiPlus Member Icon  (9 of 81) 
 887.9 in reply to 887.8 
<<Wonder what the 'Honorable Oukah' would have to say about it:|>>

Mebbe he's da one who "ordained" this guy...

BW ;)



Forum Host:

Indian Country Perspectives
Native discussion on Native issues.

 

 
From: JadeEyes4/24/01 2:24 PM 
To: Tess Lone Elk (TessLoneElk)  (10 of 81) 
 887.10 in reply to 887.1 
Hey Tess :)

For someone who's supposed to be so official, I sure never heard of him!

 

 
Navigate this discussion: 1-10 11-20 21-30 ... 61-70 71-80 81
Adjust text size:
Using a mobile device? Switch to the Mobile Site.

Welcome, guest! Get more out of Delphi Forums by logging in.

New to Delphi Forums? You can log in with your Facebook, Twitter, or Google account or use the New Member Login option and log in with any email address.

Home | Help | Forums | Chat | Blogs | Advertising | Membership Plans
© Delphi Forums LLC All rights reserved. Privacy Policy. Terms of Service.