PAULFROMNYS

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Based on Malachi 3:16-18 I believe the Lord will harken to us as we consider his word together.

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Romans 5   New Testament

Started Sep-6 by PAULFROMNYS; 167 views.
PAULFROMNYS

From: PAULFROMNYS

Sep-6

   The local family will be gathered around Romans 5 this Friday.  Any insights or thought provoking questions APPRECIATED.

Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-7

PAULFROMNYS said:

 The local family will be gathered around Romans 5 this Friday.

Romans 5 is the place to point out the two aspects of God's full salvation.

The first is legal in nature and was accomplished by Christ's death.

The other is related to life, is organic in nature, and was accomplished by Christ's resurrection.

By the death of Christ, the Lamb of God, we are redeemed, justified (Romans 3:24) and reconciled to God (Romans 5:10).

All three of these terms are legal terms. 

Justified means to be declared not guilty by the righteous Judge according to His standard of righteousness.

Redeemed means Christ paid the price to purchase us out of slavery and back to our rightful owner, God.

Reconciled means there was a problem between us and God, but because Christ died, our standing before God has been restored.

Romans 5:10 takes a turn from the judicial aspect to the organic aspect of salvation. 

Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

"We were reconciled" and "we shall be saved by His life." 

In Romans 2 you have sinners. In Romans 8 you have sons. In Romans 12 you have the Body. This is Paul's gospel. Sinners becoming sons which constitute the Body is the issue of God's salvation in life.

We really do need to know these Scriptural terms and what they mean. 

JS5777

From: JS5777

Sep-7

A very slight refining to the very good point that Fred was bringing out.

Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

In the Old Testament.

Lev 17:11  For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.

But the author of the Book of Hebrews pointed out the very valid detail.

Heb 9:11  But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
Heb 9:12  Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
Heb 9:13  For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
Heb 9:14  How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
Heb 9:15  And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Heb 10:1  For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
Heb 10:2  For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
Heb 10:3  But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
Heb 10:4  For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

All that, THAT blood (of goats and calves) could do was to cover sins but NOT remove the sinful nature, because the life that was in the blood of THOSE sacrifices is not compatible with man (created in the image and likeness of God).

But when a truly perfect sacrifice came, which was BOTH without sin AND whose Life was compatible with man, THAT Life could and does, not only forgive sins, but ALSO, by entering into us to dwell, it changes and transforms us from within, to no longer have the sinful nature. THAT is salvation. NOT to just have our sins forgiven, but to ALSO have our nature transformed from within by the power of His Life dwelling within us.

THAT is the detail in;

Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

The forgiveness of all past sins can happen in an instant, but often times, learning to be conformed to His divine nature takes a lifetime.

2 Pet 1:3  According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
2 Pet 1:4  Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Therefore, salvation becomes a lifestyle even more that a one-time event.

Salvation is what we have at EVERY moment, because He is the I AM.

 

Shalom,

JS5777

  • Edited September 7, 2022 8:57 pm  by  JS5777
In reply toRe: msg 3
PAULFROMNYS

From: PAULFROMNYS

Sep-8

   YES, the thought of a forerunner into a nature and the accompanying mature life is Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.  We, through Him, enter the reality of His inheritance before GOD into the perfect completion of all GODs thoughts regarding us as His children.  This, as Fred made clear, places us in a body grown healthy and strong under its headship.

PAULFROMNYS

From: PAULFROMNYS

Sep-8

see above reply comment to James. What say ye?  

In reply toRe: msg 3
Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-8

JS5777 said:

Therefore, salvation becomes a lifestyle even more that a one-time event.

Yes. That is why Peter says that we have been regenerated (begotten again), that is the salvation of our spirit, but are looking forward to the end of our faith, the salvation of our soul. This is a life long process.

1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

1 Peter 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Salvation in God's life has an initial aspect, we are begotten again our spirit, and a progressing aspect, the salvation of our souls.

In reply toRe: msg 3
Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-8

JS5777 said:

Salvation is what we have at EVERY moment, because He is the I AM.

Amen. According to Hebrews 12:1, the Christian life is a race. According to Romans 4, we should "walk in the steps of the faith of our father Abraham." I think that means that we are on a journey, with steps. Many believers do not have this concept.

Hebrews 12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

Romans 4:12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

In reply toRe: msg 3
Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-8

JS5777 said:

Lev 17:11  For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.

This is at the heart of our conversation in Genesis. Jehovah God breathed into the man's nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul, a person. Often in the Old Testament people are referred to as "souls."

Genesis 2:7 And the LORD God formed -- man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

The word "psuche" or soul, is translated as life in many English versions.

The word "zoe" the divine, uncreated life that is from God and is God, is also translated as life.

Here is an example:

John 10-11 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly. I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.

Christ came that we might have zoe, the divine, uncreated life of the Father, for that, He gave His psuche, His human life.

We are postulating that Adam became a living soul, with the natural human life, but did not receive zoe, the tree of life. He had the God created potential to receive zoe, the life of God, but did not.

PAULFROMNYS

From: PAULFROMNYS

Sep-8

   Fred said:  We are postulating that Adam became a living soul, with the natural human life, but did not receive zoe, the tree of life. He had the God created potential to receive zoe, the life of God, but did not.

   Paul replied:  Amen, how could that totally begotten of the life of GOD ever disobey the Word of GOD???   The only possible understanding to me currently is that GOD knew and allowed that life take its own course before Him.  Patiently going through that, He nurtured and admonished His own into His only begotten Son = the tree of Life.  When the time was right He appeared to restore us to our Father; incorruptibly, eternally.

Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-8

PAULFROMNYS said:

Patiently going through that, He nurtured and admonished His own into His only begotten Son = the tree of Life. 

Here is a good point. A tree is made of wood and indicates the cross.

1 Peter 2:24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose -- stripes ye were healed.

Life indicates the resurrection.

John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: life here is zoe, the divine, uncreated, eternal life of God.

The tree....of life. The crucified, resurrected Christ who is now a life-giving Spirit for us to receive and live and walk by daily. 

I believe that the tree of life is a vine. A vine is a tree that is low and easily accessible. "I am the true vine." John 15:1

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