Bus safety issues -  Why no seatbelts on school buses (145 views) Notify me whenever anyone posts in this discussion.Subscribe
From: RGoss99Feb-16 5:25 PM 
To: krathyn3 (Phantom7031) DelphiPlus Member Icon  (11 of 23) 
 5162.11 in reply to 5162.2 

Three to a seat I have only seen in America. Fat kids is not a problema because where there are seats for two, the belt is long enough to have the ritght seat belt long enough th attach to the left.

However, not mentioned is the type of seat belts in cars. A few weeks ago, in the second seat of a land rover, was a mother, kid, and me. all with seat belts. legally the kid did not need a car seat but I suggested to the mother that he put the shoulder strap behind him and rely only on the waist strap. I had a high school student who was in an accident, which while the seat belt saved her life, has a scar running from below her left ear, to across her chest between her breasts. because the attichment point was too high for her.

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From: RGoss99Feb-16 5:27 PM 
To: Gimmie Chocolate Shorty (TOILETHEA1) DelphiPlus Member Icon  (12 of 23) 
 5162.12 in reply to 5162.7 

Actually there is an easy answer physicly, the problema is economic.


From: Gimmie Chocolate Shorty (TOILETHEA1) DelphiPlus Member Icon Posted by hostFeb-16 6:53 PM 
To: RGoss99  (13 of 23) 
 5162.13 in reply to 5162.9 

It is expensive to install them on school buses, and to retrofit older buses is even more expensive.

The question is, how effectivie would they be?  What's to keep a child from unbuckling while the bus is moving? In an acutual emergency, like a fire or driving into flooded waters, would children be able to unbuckle themselves quickly?   So many questions, no real good answer.


From: krathyn3 (Phantom7031) DelphiPlus Member Icon Posted by hostFeb-17 12:52 AM 
To: RGoss99  (14 of 23) 
 5162.14 in reply to 5162.9 

great idea having public buses having hte timing for the schools. we have that in places where there are no school buses, too.
do your public buses have seat belts? Ours do not.



From: RGoss99Feb-17 4:06 AM 
To: Gimmie Chocolate Shorty (TOILETHEA1) DelphiPlus Member Icon  (15 of 23) 
 5162.15 in reply to 5162.13 

I agree there is nothing to prevent the kid from unbuckling, which is why there is the other issue.

America is very big on rights, but not so good on personal responsibility, so while seat belts are a government responsibility, 

it is a social responsibility to train kids to act responsibily, because we can never protect kids from their choice to be irresponsible.

As for the other it is a trade off but where cost is a factor it often is a negative with people who are selfish and attemptig to evade their social responsibility.


From: RGoss99Feb-17 4:47 AM 
To: krathyn3 (Phantom7031) DelphiPlus Member Icon  (16 of 23) 
 5162.16 in reply to 5162.14 

fseat belts originally only front seats and those facing the rear exit, now all both public and chárter transport.

We have an advantage here when it comes to space. My village is surrounded by 7 other villages at the end of an 8-12k radius.

everything in between is Green belt, forest or agricultura where few people live. We also do not have front, back, or side yards

which means people live closer togather. In my village of 5000, "out of town is only a 5-10 minute walk. As a result 90% of our

primary students walk or bike to school. However our high school draws from 4 other villages, so those students need a bus ride.

For the few who live in between in the "campo" there are bus shelters at designated places, these are not scheduled stops, but

all one needs to do is wave their hand to get the bus to stop. For lower primary the driver has a list, and reserves seats at the

front for them, and the school has an aid or teacher at the bus stop to make sure they get on or off and too or from school.

For the high school kids, obviously on the school schedule their public bus is full enough to be economicly feasable. In keeping

with this the driver abandons his bus until school lets out, and takes another bus back to his base, from which he drives other buses

not a part of the school Schedule. 

OT but since this is a bus site. Very Little cash changes hands as we have a series of different bus passes. In my case I sabe money by

paying for 20 rides village to city. So when boarding, except to say "hi" I have no contact with the driver, put my card on the scanner which

deducts a ride, and tells the driver where to let me off. School kids cards are free during school days, OAPs, card charges less. Some

companies pay for cards for their workers Good on woork days. Since my village is not a tourist village, my gripe is tourists who tend to 

not follow the rules, even though they are posted in English. At the terminus one day there was an English couple behind me, with luggage.

Smiling I suggested to the woman, that they stow their luggage with my bike in the under carriage. She was about to when her sarky husband

said what business is it of yours, so she didn´t. But when they got to the pay point the driver informed him that all carry on that would not fit in

the overhead, had to go below, which meant he had to plow through those behind him to go below. We don´t allow eating or drinking or loud music 

on our public buses (some chárter buses have trays like airplanes though). Drivers don´t change much and most of the passengers are regular

so there is a lot of verbal communication between them (in French rural buses, there is often a hand shake with the driver from a male passenger and

a Kiss from a female - here there is usually a thank you, and have a nice day when deboarding) In the capital there are both bus and bike lanes. All our public

buses, have a two seat vacant space half way back on the right side, with a special door and lifting aparatus for Wheel chairs.

Security: all of our buses have transponders and radio access like airplanes. One day there was a forest fire btween the capital and the first stop, so

the radio informed the driver and his CRT generated a different rout to avoid it. We are an island, and occasionally get illegal boat people dumped in some cove

walk inland to take a bus to the city. One day for the first bus after noon, there was just a woman and myself waiting, she boarded as I stowed my bike, but between

us 4 black guys, all wearing flip flops and carrying Little plastic bags got on, did not talk and did not sit togather. I was sitting at the back. As we passed the last stop

before the city I walked to the front and asked "how many black people does he usually have mid day". The driver said "none" and pointed to his transponder which

showed a series of numbers, the first being a "7" which for airplanes indicates some sort of problem. I smiled and returned to my seat. As we entered the city some men

dressed like road workers installed some barriers indicating a detour into a park. The bus was surrounded, anda member of the Guardia Civil entered the rear and another at the

front, and asked everyone to deboard at the front to produce their national identity card (when we got back on, all the Blacks were being loaded into a pólice van. Lost time about

5 minutes. Since everyone is Spain is required to have (but not necessarily carry) a national identity card, no one can shout racism, because the driver and all the passengers were checked.


From: Gimmie Chocolate Shorty (TOILETHEA1) DelphiPlus Member Icon Posted by hostFeb-17 6:46 AM 
To: RGoss99  (17 of 23) 
 5162.17 in reply to 5162.15 

True. People are hollering about their rights, but no one want's responisbility.  I could name cases after cases all day long.  Where did it go wrong? The early 60's is my guess, my generation, baby boomers, were brought up better then that.

Money properly spent could do so much good, like making schools and school buses safer.


From: RGoss99Feb-17 11:00 AM 
To: Gimmie Chocolate Shorty (TOILETHEA1) DelphiPlus Member Icon  (18 of 23) 
 5162.18 in reply to 5162.17 

The only American examples where the concept of responsibility and guilt are separated is insurance and crime.

Say you are in a car accident, got hit by another car not stopping for a stop sign. That driver is obviously guilty, but often you share a tiny bit of responsibility for not noticing that the car comming from the right was not going to stop. As a result if your insurance company ends up in paying a number of such claims, somewhere their computer decides that the risk of insuring you is above average so your rates go up even though you were not guilty in every accident.

The same goes for crimes in a different way, the perp is declared guilty, but some times his sentence depends on the amount of contributary negligence (irresponsibility) on the part of the victim. 

As a culture, inspite of the stereotype, we are not a heavy drinking culture. Statistics indicate that those in trouble for alcohol related incidents, are disproportunately tourists from countries with the stricter laws involving alcohol, which also have a higher rate of alcoholism.

Havine said that we have an illegal event called the "botillón" where young people gather to drink, cheaper then bars, someone buys a keg, straws, and a bucket. Young people go to an isolated place to "party" and "hookup" - bad things happen. There was arecent incident of 14 year old girl going to one such in an abadoned wearhouse. evently there was some sex involved, and a video made which got circulated. So the girl was obviously embarassed, and some time after she claimed rape. Yes, adult males having sex with a minor is a crime and that there is no doubt that they were guilty of some illegal sexual contact. If this girl was attacked on a public Street, walking home from the public library, I would say, "yes" throw the book at the perps give them the máximum penalti. But here are some facts regarding personal responsibility on the part of the girl. What was she, at age 14, after curfew,  doing tresspassing an abandoned Factory at a party knonn for alcoholic exesss and sexual encounters. Was there any evidence that the perps got her drunk, if she was. Did she claim rape that night or the day after, or only after the video became public. no blood test, no repe test. she was tested after the fact, no evidence of forced entry or physical damage, only evidence was DNA matching one of the perps on her underware (obviously not changed in 48 hours) So on a crime scale, I would say the perps were 100% guilty of a crime, and over 50% responsable for the event, but somewhere between 1% and 49% the girl was acting irresponsible, withoutwhich the event would not have happened. 


From: Bike (URALTOURIST1) DelphiPlus Member IconFeb-17 12:10 PM 
To: krathyn3 (Phantom7031) DelphiPlus Member Icon  (19 of 23) 
 5162.19 in reply to 5162.14 

In very large districts (many Florida districts, and many California districts as well as other states) with 20-30 or more schools with as many as 2,000 students per school, coordination of public transit would be more than a small nightmare.  In my quite rural county with NO decent public transit at all and multiple very large high schools of 1,500+ students (5 at last count, 4 smaller) and a gaggle of middle, charter, elementary, and specials would make a real challenge.


USCG Engineer 1961-1982
RN, Acute Care specialist 1986-2008
  • Edited February 17, 2020 12:21 pm  by  Bike (URALTOURIST1)

From: Gimmie Chocolate Shorty (TOILETHEA1) DelphiPlus Member Icon Posted by hostFeb-17 12:21 PM 
To: Bike (URALTOURIST1) DelphiPlus Member Icon  (20 of 23) 
 5162.20 in reply to 5162.19 

I agree, it really would be.  School districts can't afford such expenditures, the normal things, fuel, labor, maintence, are  high enough.


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