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MerlinsDad

From: MerlinsDad

Jul-6

And very often they are not facts, they are opinions.  I always provide my reasoning for claiming that they are incorrect. 

MerlinsDad

From: MerlinsDad

Jul-6

That statement has been around for a long time and has been used in many different situations when the facts quoted were inaccurate, made up, or were what Kellyanne Conway referred to as "alternate facts," January 22, 2017

Daniel Patrick Moynihan,, "Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts."

  • Variant: Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but they are not entitled to their own facts.
    • Quoted in Robert Sobel's review of Past Imperfect: History According to the Movies edited by Mark C. Carnes.
  • Variant: You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts.
    • Quoted in Timothy J. Penny, [1], National Review September 4, 2003.
  • Variant: You’re entitled to your own opinions. You’re not entitled to your own facts.
  • However, proceedings of a Senate Intelligence Committee in 1980 attribute the identical quote to James R. Schlesinger (at p. 110), possibly made during the course of 1973 Congressional testimony.
  • Also see Bernard Baruch, who said "Every man has a right to his own opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts." in the January 6, 1950 issue of the Deming (New Mexico) Headlight
    https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Daniel_Patrick_Moynihan

Showtalk
Staff

From: Showtalk

Jul-6

You are missing the point.  It doesn’t need to be fought to the death. We are taking about opinions.  Mine are based in what I have read.  You have no idea that the police cases were not caused by the virus. I would think the people speaking know more than you do about it.  Instead, you insist on taking someone else’s opinion because they throw numbers at it, but mostly because it supports your beliefs, which are... opinions.  And worse, you don’t even try to understand what I’m saying.  If every post turns into an argument over who can throw up the most facts, we have no discussion.  Why are you so positive you are always right? No one is right 100% of the time.

Showtalk
Staff

From: Showtalk

Jul-6

And there you go again. You have no idea if his piece is factual, but you disagree with it, so you discount it.  We can’t have a discussion when you are so closed minded.  I like discussing, but it’s not going anywhere. Have you noticed when a discussion gets like that, everyone else stops posting? That isn’t a discussion, it’s a monologue.

Showtalk
Staff

From: Showtalk

Jul-6

You really don’t see how insulting and closed minded that is? In my experience, people throw that out when they are losing an argument as a last ditch effort.  It’s basically a way to say, “Shut up and agree with me.”

  • Edited July 6, 2020 9:30 pm  by  Showtalk
MerlinsDad

From: MerlinsDad

Jul-6

showtalk  The fun in it for me is doing the research required to refute opinion.  Those opinions, by the way, are seldom yours, but some you have posted from some conservative opinion piece or another.  As I said, the fun is doing the research and structuring a tight refutation.

You know so little about me but you are more than willing to make assumptions.  You seem so opposed to the way I discuss that I am more than willing to withdraw from this forum, 

MerlinsDad

From: MerlinsDad

Jul-6

showtalk says:  "Instead, you insist on taking someone else’s opinion because they throw numbers at it, but mostly because it supports your beliefs, which are... opinions."

Of course they are.  Isn't this an opinion forum?  The strength of the opinion is how well supported it is by the applicable facts. 

showtalk says:  "Why are you so positive you are always right? No one is right 100% of the time."

I'm not.  That's why I do so much research.  I want to make sure that my opinions are based upon the facts or the best available opinion.  That's the point.  You trust your opinion pieces and I trust mine.  That's as it should be,  In the difference lies the discussion.  It's never an argument; it's always a comparison of opinions bolstered of course by facts.

You have no idea that the police cases were not caused by the virus.

I have no idea if they were or were not, but I'm willing to hold my opinion in abeyance until a scientific study either confirms or rejects the hypothesis.  As I said in the earlier post:  "there is no causal link between the protests and the increases, merely an opinion, a supposition,  Further investigation may or may not show a causal link, but today, it's merely opinion and open to debate and refutation,"

That's being opened minded. 

showtalks says: "I would think the people speaking know more than you do about it."

I criticized the rush to judgment with no evidence, only supposition, and that's all it is at this point -- supposition.  I could go on and point out that there's such consistency in the condemnations that there appears to be an underlying motive or motives.

showtalk says:  "And worse, you don’t even try to understand what I’m saying."

I've already pointed out that if I didn't understand it I would be unable to construct a coherent refutation.

MerlinsDad

From: MerlinsDad

Jul-6

No.  It's time to stop and examine the facts and see which ones stand the sniff test as they say.  In the particular incident where I cited Kellyanne Conway, the facts didn't stand the sniff test or the photographic evidence, so she dismissed the failed sniff test by calling them alternate facts; in other words "her own facts." 

Believe me.  It currently gets applied a lot.

MerlinsDad

From: MerlinsDad

Jul-6

showtalk says:  "I like discussing, but it’s not going anywhere" 

You use that phrase a lot.  What does it mean to you? 

MerlinsDad

From: MerlinsDad

Jul-6

I know that he has made several invalid assumptions.  That's always the starting point.

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