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Are the vaccines causing the variants?   The Serious You: How Current Events Affect You

Started Nov-28 by WALTER784; 1149 views.
WALTER784

Poll Question From WALTER784

Nov-28

Are the vaccines causing the variants?
  • Yes (provide scientific proof)5  votes
    41%
  • No (provide scientific proof)5  votes
    41%
  • I don't know2  votes
    16%
Yes (provide scientific proof) 
No (provide scientific proof) 
I don't know 
In reply toRe: msg 1
WALTER784

From: WALTER784 

Nov-29

We have one "No" but no supportive scientific evidence to back it up. If you don't have such evidence then reply "I don't know"!

This poll is not about how you feel, it's about whether you have scientific proof one way or the other that the vaccinate is or is not causing the variants. Without irrefutable scientific evidence, the only logical answer is "I don't know"!

Edited to add: [This is not a trick question. Either there is scientific evidence that proves it is or is not causing the variants or you don't know.]

FWIW

  • Edited November 29, 2021 10:21 am  by  WALTER784
In reply toRe: msg 2
WALTER784

From: WALTER784 

Nov-29

I find this poll quite perplexing, intriguing and interesting to say the least.

We have 30 views but only 4 replies. 

3 say they don't know. 1 says no but with no scientific evidence. So I'll take that one as a "I don't know" because there is no scientific evidence.

But as 30 have viewed it but only 4 replies... perhaps the others who have yet to reply are hesitant.

If you think you have evidence... cough it up... one way or the other.

But what if... perhaps... maybe... it might be proven wrong is your concern... then you should answer "I don't know"!

Only those who answer Yes or No with scientific proof one way or the other will be known. All the rest who answer "I don't know" will not be known unless you speak up.

So why all the hesitancy? If you don't know, then say so! Nobody will know who you are unless you speak up!

I was expecting a 95% or greater "I don't know" response but 98% have refused to answer.

And thus, the perplexity, bewilderment, intrigue and interest only builds greater.

Either you know one way or the other with proof or you don't.

And if you don't... your answer should be "I don't know"!

Edited to add: [If it doesn't fit your narrative... then you don't know.]

FWIW

  • Edited November 29, 2021 10:24 am  by  WALTER784
Showtalk
Host

From: Showtalk 

Nov-29

I voted No, because there was no Other option which would have been the correct answer.  Saying I don’t know means that I don’t even have an opinion, which I do.  The issue is that a vaccine can’t cause a variant.  I know that for a fact.  The vaccine can possibly make an environment where a variant can overtake the vaccine protections but itmis not a catalyst for an opportunistic virus.  The virus does not set out to kill the host.  Even tough people died, a virus would kill itself off if the purpose was to kill everyone.  It wants to continue to exist so it does whatever it needs to from a viral standpoint do spread.  

WALTER784

From: WALTER784 

Nov-29

Well then... without proof, your No is counted as an I don't know. If you had proof you would know either one way or the other. Without proof, you cannot claim that you know and therefore you don't know.

Like I initially said... it's not a trick question. You either know one way or the other (with scientific proof) or you don't.

Without the scientific proof, you don't know and thus that should have been the proper answer.

But as for why so many others read this post but refuse to answer is bewildering to say the least. 

If you think you have scientific evidence but are afraid of it being proven wrong, then in fact, you don't know and that's regardless of whether you wanted to reply yes or not.

If you don't know... reply "I don't know"... if you know... cough up the scientific evidence that proves you know what you are talking about.

No tricks... just looking for straight answers. Either you know one way or the other (with scientific evidence) or you don't know.

But I see a lot of hesitancy in people admitting that they don't know for some strange reason or another.

FWIW

Showtalk
Host

From: Showtalk 

Nov-29

Because it’s an opinion forum.  Yes, I could have voted I don’t know but I knew we would have a better discussion if I voted the way that made more sense to me.

In reply toRe: msg 1
EdGlaze

From: EdGlaze 

Nov-30

NO

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/a-new-strain-of-coronavirus-what-you-should-know

Variants of viruses occur when there is a change — or mutation — to the virus’s genes. Ray says it is the nature of RNA viruses such as the coronavirus to evolve and change gradually. “Geographic separation tends to result in genetically distinct variants,” he says.

Mutations in viruses — including the coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic — are neither new nor unexpected. Bollinger explains: “All RNA viruses mutate over time, some more than others. For example, flu viruses change often, which is why doctors recommend that you get a new flu vaccine every year."

WALTER784

From: WALTER784 

Nov-30

Several things in your article:

>>>He notes that some of the mutations seem to affect the coronavirus’s spike protein, which covers the outer coating of SARS-CoV-2 and give the virus its characteristic spiny appearance. These proteins help the virus attach to human cells in the nose, lungs and other areas of the body.

“Researchers have preliminary evidence that some of the new variants seem to bind more tightly to our cells” Bollinger says. “ This appears to make some of these new strains ‘stickier’ due to changes in the spike protein and therefore more easily transmitted.”<<<

Where have we heard similar about spike proteins in this thread from over 5 or 6 months ago about spikes created by the vaccines exacerbating the situation? I would have to dig up the post, but I think Dee quoted several articles saying similar.

On another note, this was published online 2016 Jul 8 by Mechanisms of viral mutation (nih.gov)

>>>The mutation rate of an organism is defined as the probability that a change in genetic information is passed to the next generation. 

In viruses, a generation is often defined as a cell infection cycle, which includes attachment to the cell surface, entry, gene expression, replication, encapsidation, and release of infectious particles. 
 
Mutations are not restricted to replication since they can also result from editing of the genetic material, or spontaneous nucleic acid damage. 
 
The mutation rate should not be confused with the frequency at which mutations are found in a given viral population. 
 
The latter is a measure of genetic variation that depends on a number of other processes such as natural selection, random genetic drift, recombination, and so on. 
 
Higher mutation rates lead to higher genetic diversity but, except in special cases, it is not possible to infer mutation rates directly from observed population mutation frequencies. 
 
Although genetic diversity depends on multiple factors, the mutation rate is of particular interest because it constitutes the ultimate source of genetic variation. 
 
Similarly, mutation rates should not be confused with molecular evolutionary rates. The neutral theory of molecular evolution posits a linear relationship between these two rates, but whereas mutation is a biochemical/genetic process, molecular evolution refers to the fixation of new alleles in populations.<<<
 
Note in particular the red portion above >>>can also result from editing of the genetic material<<<... and isn't the mRNA vaccine genetically edited to cause spike protines?
 
FWIW
  • Edited November 30, 2021 7:57 am  by  WALTER784
me (DENNIS4927)

From: me (DENNIS4927) 

Nov-30

I'll admit I voted I don't know because i don't. I will say I don't know who or what to believe anymore.
WALTER784

From: WALTER784 

Nov-30

Thanks for your honest answer. The majority should vote "I don't know" unless they absolutely know otherwise.

Posting something you believe to be the truth doesn't necessarily make it true or false. If you're posting because you think it might be true... you should answer "I don't know".

Personally, me too, I don't know myself. But I have my suspicions, however they're just that... suspicions and thus I don't really know.

FWIW

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