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LMAO Germany adopts an AR-15   Small Arms <20mm

Started 14/9/20 by QuintusO; 31042 views.
poliorcetes

From: poliorcetes

25-May

As far as I remember, the other candidates were Galil and Sig 552. Sig one was too much expensive, and Galil was outdated. After that, HK achieved a monocultive position: Spanish MoD don't adquiere systems outside of Obendorf :(. And lately we even don't built them

poliorcetes

From: poliorcetes

25-May

how would a receiver substitution be far from a field strip and change of the old polymer receiver?

I mean, disassembling like this doesn't seem to need a armorer, and neither changing the receiver for another one...

stancrist

From: stancrist

25-May

Poli, I don't know enough about the G36 to answer that.

stancrist

From: stancrist

25-May

roguetechie said:

In the replacement program you don't have to break down the guns sort and gauge the parts refinish them reorder out of spec pieces etc....

Yeah.  I was only addressing your statement that the upgrade option would require pulling the old guns back to depots, and cost money to do so.  The replacement option would also require pulling the old guns back to depots, incurring the same costs.

I was remiss in not saying that I agree with you regarding cost of disassembly, sorting, gauging, and other aspects of doing an upgrade.

roguetechie said:

In a way going to a new rifle is "easier" on several fronts.

Concur.

EmericD

From: EmericD

26-May

I don't understand how the price could widely change during one contract.

Do you mean that the USMC had a good price for the 50,000 guns they ordered after the initial M27 contract (~8400 rifles), then the price goes up again after that contract because they wanted more guns?

The only information I have is that the price tag was around 1300$ per rifle for the 50,000 rifles contract, to be delivered between 2018 and 2023.

roguetechie

From: roguetechie

26-May

The price went back up on everything but that contract yes and that's not the only contract delivering 416's.

The Marines are paying about 3k per gun for everything but those, and they may not even be getting all of those for $1500.

Considering what the 416 Is and the price of an m4a1 (still under $700) it's way too much at $1500 anyway.

Also on the being forced to buy an entire BCG every time they need a replacement bolt, they're paying disturbingly close to the cost of an m4 per BCG due to how the sustainment contract is written.

Edit: and I know I don't need to remind you how much the 416 doesn't like m855a1. Because the Marines use m855a1 their breakage rates are phenomenally higher than if they were using a different round.

We talked once about how the 416 could be adapted to fire m855a1 without beating up the gun as much. But since it's the DOD and they don't change tdp's that won't happen.

So the Marines are stuck with a too expensive gun that breaks parts at 2-3 times the rate of m4a1 and they're paying on average many times as much to get Spares because of how their sustainment contract is written.

roguetechie

From: roguetechie

26-May

It's all good Stan, it provided an opportunity to clarify things a little better.

poliorcetes

From: poliorcetes

26-May

But just pay attention to that basic disassembly that I posted. Dude, less than 20 operations, change receiver, assembly again

stancrist

From: stancrist

26-May

Dude, the exploded diagram you posted only shows the various components.  It tells me nothing about what tools might be needed, or what procedures must be followed to separate them.

For instance, what is involved in barrel removal and installation?  Does it require special tools?  Does it need to be headspaced?  If so, do those tasks need to be done by an armorer?

And I'm puzzled why you even asked me the question, since my statement was only about pulling guns back to the depot.  I did not express any opinion on the ease or difficulty of performing an upgrade.

roguetechie

From: roguetechie

26-May

http://hk-manuals.com/

You can download the full armorer manual set for it here.

It's only medium involved.

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