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Military Guns and Ammunition

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This is intended for people interested in the subject of military guns and their ammunition, with emphasis on automatic weapons.

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LMAO Germany adopts an AR-15   Small Arms <20mm

Started 14/9/20 by QuintusO; 34805 views.
poliorcetes

From: poliorcetes

22/9/20

I'm trying to fully understand the role of a replaceable cam in extending rifle's lifespan

Would you be (or anybody) be so kindly to develop it?

QuintusO

From: QuintusO

22/9/20

An AR-15 does not have APE which means the interior of the aluminum receiver stops the bolt from locking prematurely. Over time the wall of the receiver at the cam pin location wears out and the upper has to be replaced.

tidusyuki

From: tidusyuki

23/9/20

The wears could also be minimized by using a roller cam pin. Then again it's patented stuff so companies don't go around making one.

Wonder why E. Stoner made the cam pin rectangular instead of smooth rounding in the first place.

  • Edited 23 September 2020 5:03  by  tidusyuki
QuintusO

From: QuintusO

23/9/20

The roller isn't in patent. There are Armalite guns from 1960 with roller cam pins.

It's ultimately unnecessary and adds cost, which is probably what they were thinking at the time (would have been Sullivan and Fremont). However I agree a roller is an improvement. My guns avoid this issue entirely by using an APE rod.

roguetechie

From: roguetechie

23/9/20

The APE rod is ideally the best way to go yeah

nincomp

From: nincomp

23/9/20

I apologize in advance but... would an up-scaled 50 BMG variant use a Great Ape rod?

QuintusO

From: QuintusO

23/9/20

There's no reason it couldn't.

Jeff (Jefffar)

From: Jeff (Jefffar)

23/9/20

nincomp said:

I apologize in advance but... would an up-scaled 50 BMG variant use a Great Ape rod?

Are you trying to make a monkey out of us? 

poliorcetes

From: poliorcetes

24/9/20

Thank you, Nathaniel. What does APE mean?

Thinking about the entire fleet, what I understand is that uppers are intended to resist a huge amount of rounds shooted. Three barrels would be changed during the entire lifecycle of the product, more or less?

Have 416 design implement such a cam replacement? I wasn't aware of it

Thanks again

roguetechie

From: roguetechie

24/9/20

APE is short for antipreengagement and it's a feature of bolts/bolt carriers not a specific component. Anti preengagement features essentially prevent the bolt itself from trying to rotate/unlock up until the point in the firing cycle where it's time to commence the unlocking cycle. 

As an example, the AK has an antipreengagement feature in it's cam track that requires a solid whack to get past and start the bolt rotating. The israeli bullpup uses a system quite similar to the desert eagle pistols to handle this 

The vanilla AR15 doesn't have a whole bunch In the way of antipreengagement features which results in the steel cam pin putting pretty serious sliding force pressure on the inside wall of the upper receiver.

In a bunch of Sig's guns like virtus mcx et Al they've compensated for this by implementing changeable steel raceways in this part of the upper. Caracal/haenel also do a version of this (same designers).

The 416 does not have any version of this implemented though. In vanilla AR15's it's not all that much of a big deal either because, frankly, stripped uppers cost less to replace than the pair of shoes you're probably wearing now.

Ideally though antipreengagement features are like sufficient underslide and extra run-out distance for the bolt carrier in that they can and do improve efficiency and functionality while dirty/at high round counts.

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