schnuersi said:

Since there are vehicles everywhere there are GPMGs everywhere. In the past on pintle mounts nowadays often on RWS. So what is the point of issuing carbines or rifles? The PDW is absolutely sufficient to buy time until a GPMG or heavier weapon can chime in.

Hmm.  Replacing rifles and carbines with a PDW would permit elimination of 5.56x45 guns and ammo from the inventory in addition to those in 9x19 caliber, which would tremendously simplify logistics and training. 

Plus, it would reduce the soldier's weight burden, while also enabling a substantial increase in basic ammo load.  And being able to carry 300-400 rounds of ammo in 40-round magazines would enhance the ability to use the "area saturation" method to defeat Level IV body armor.  (Disregard the pistol in the pic.)

In addition, using a compact, lightweight PDW would better enable the infantry to evolve from the centuries-old paradigm of shooting bullets that put little holes in people and things, into a combat force that wields weapons of far greater destructive power.

Okay, you convinced me.  I'm in!

Not to drag an old horse carcass out of the ditch, but: now all you need is a cartridge to feed the infantry's machineguns and DMRs :)

I think they already have one.  

People have been suggesting just this - more HE, less KE - for some time now.

Sure, you'll still need machine guns, but having PDW + HE lobbers + MG would probably be more effective than the current setup, and would only need 2 calibers in guns that are actually good on their jobs.

To add some spice to this thread - what HE lobbers? Mainly RPG with the odd NLAW here and there, plus ATGM for certain scenarios?

Maybe something like this  

That video is very intersting 

On the combat medic and other people thing, blue force gear and Vickers make a medics sling with dual tri glides to snug your carbine to your body while doing stuff that requires both hands. For most mos' this is actually sufficient to make a carbine good enough for most.

Especially if you went down to a 10.5-12.5 inch barrel.

I can definitely agree with this.

In my own experience I have had to go all the way down to a g26 so I can pocket carry while I work because even a compact handgun can get annoying and limit range of motion etc.

To say nothing of the bruising scraping etc if you're doing something very physical.

renatohm said:

People have been suggesting just this - more HE, less KE - for some time now.

Yes.  Gatnerd and others were much faster than I to see the potential of the "more HE, less KE" concept.

It was only after the lengthy discussion with schnuersi that it dawned on me that the infantry squad does not necessarily have to be a rifle squad.

After all, there was a time when the infantryman's standard individual weapon was not even a firearm.

Hmm.  That picture makes me wonder -- if this were 500 BC, would schnuersi be arguing that infantry soldiers should not carry a sword as a secondary weapon?

(Just kidding.)

Gustav plus at least 1 40mm grenade launcher per fire team. Say, 1 Gustav, 1 40 grenadier, 2 ammo bearers/riflemen for 1st team. 1 MG, 1 40, 2 ammo bearers for 2nd team. Squad leader has rifle, SDM with SDMR, a comms specialist and then drone operator for command element. M4A1s for everyone but Gustav, MG, and SDM, they'll carry pistols for backup.