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Northrop and Rheinmetall partner on long range guided 155mm   General Military Discussion

Started 20-Apr by gatnerd; 674 views.
gatnerd

From: gatnerd

20-Apr

Possibility of a guided 155mm with a 55-75km range.

https://www.edrmagazine.eu/rheinmetall-and-northrop-grumman-agree-to-strategic-partnership-for-precision-guided-enhanced-range-artillery-ammunition

Idea is to fit the existing V-LAP projectile, which can fly 55-75km depending on barrel length:

https://en.topwar.ru/164952-v-juar-ustanovili-rekord-dalnosti-strelby-stvolnoj-artillerii.html

And then fit it with a guidance system to allow precision strikes at those distances; note the nose fins in this mockup, which would provide guidance:

TonyDiG

From: TonyDiG

20-Apr

I have to question the barrel lengths given in this article which also make me question how accurate the rest of the article is.

gatnerd said...

https://en.topwar.ru/164952-v-juar-ustanovili-rekord-dalnosti-strelby-stvolnoj-artillerii.html

 

155mm barrel lengths are given as 5, 6 and 2,000 calibers long.  Pretty sure that they are either 39 or 52 calibers and the last is likely the PzH2000 SPG.  Possibly mistaking G5 and G6 designations as describing the barrel length.

gatnerd

From: gatnerd

20-Apr

https://soldiersystems.net/2021/04/19/rheinmetall-and-northrop-grumman-agree-to-strategic-partnership-for-precision-guided-enhanced-range-artillery-ammunition/

This article says the 76km shot was made with a 52 caliber long barrel.

Im not that up to date on various artillery and howitzer designs, so I'm not sure what type of 155 that would correspond to.

taschoene

From: taschoene

20-Apr

gatnerd said:

This article says the 76km shot was made with a 52 caliber long barrel. Im not that up to date on various artillery and howitzer designs, so I'm not sure what type of 155 that would correspond to.

That's a Rheinmetall Denel G6-52 with a 25-liter (non compliant) chamber.  Even the compliant 23-liter chamber managed 67km.  

https://defense-update.com/20191127_long_range_artillery.html#:~:text=The%20South%20African%20G6%20built,Projectile%20(V%2DLAP).

gatnerd

From: gatnerd

20-Apr

taschoene said:

That's a Rheinmetall Denel G6-52 with a 25-liter (non compliant) chamber.  Even the compliant 23-liter chamber managed 67km.

Nice. 

Curious what the range would be with the US's more dated M109 howitzer.

Mr. T (MrT4)

From: Mr. T (MrT4)

21-Apr

Considering this round is gaining range purely on velocity not so much on the aerodynamic lift of some finned guided rounds , how long will the barrel last?

gatnerd

From: gatnerd

21-Apr

Ah, having looked further into it:

https://www.rheinmetall-defence.com/media/editor_media/rm_defence/publicrelations/pressemitteilungen/2019/2019-11-27_Rheinmetall_indirect_fire_south_africa_en.pdf

It appears there are 2 types of enhanced shell. Both are the 'Assegai' south african Very Low Drag (VLD) shell profile. The M0121 BB is the 'base bleed' design, while the m2005 VLAP is a rocket assisted shell. 

The VLAP rocket assisted shell seems the more promising, getting 53.9km with the 39 length barrel and 66.9km with the 52. Both using maximum charge - but within spec. 

The 76km shot seems to be a VLAP + enhanced powder charge + possibly a longer 60 calibers barrel.

The US Army Palladin, with its 39 barrel, currently lists its range as 30km using the current generation of rocket assisted projectile. So if the VLAP can bring that range to 53.9km, thats a pretty big improvement, especially if paired with a guided shell capability. 

  • Edited 21 April 2021 5:39  by  gatnerd
In reply toRe: msg 7
gatnerd

From: gatnerd

21-Apr

From further reading, it seems Dennel/RM is looking to take the VLAP, and then also add their Pre Formed Fragment capability to the shell. Similar to the Bofors 3P and SAAB MAPAM, it uses a metal shell body lined with thousands of little BB's. The use of pre formed fragments greatly increases fragmentation beyond normal shell performance.

https://www.edrmagazine.eu/modular-improvements-for-assegai-artillery-ammunition

However from the last option, we do see that the space used by the rocket assist of the VLAP prevents the maximum fragmentation capable of a PFF full shell, and that a non PFF VLAP will have much less frag then a basic 155mm shell.

VLAP = 3,400 fragments

Regular 155mm = 13,000 fragments

VLAP PFF = 16,500 fragments

Regular range 155 PFF optimized = 30,800 fragments 

So the extra range does provide some performance drawbacks.

  • Edited 21 April 2021 5:58  by  gatnerd
Mr. T (MrT4)

From: Mr. T (MrT4)

21-Apr

Am somewhat supprised there is still 4-6% to be had.

''Finally an improved drag profile should bring in a further 4-6% range increase; trials were made using the Gerald Bull form factor. According to RDM there might still be some space for improving aerodynamics, working both on the round case itself as well as on the Base Bleed''

ZailC

From: ZailC

21-Apr

Howitzer barrel life is mainly determined by loss of accuracy; bore erosion seems to progress faster than micro-crack propagation. I recall a conversation with an ordnance officer during the Vietnam war. He said that the total distance of shells fired was as good a measure of barrel life as any other metric. In particular he thought the eight-inch howitzer tubes were good for twenty-million meters before they got too risky for 'danger-close' fire missions. 

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