Military Guns and Ammunition

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Rheinmetall Panther 2 KF51 Tank with 130mm Army Guns 20+mm

Started 14/6/22 by gatnerd; 46362 views.

Msg 1 of 432

From: gatnerd

14/6/22

Rheinmetall just debuted the Panther KF51, widely being heralded as the Panther 2 on the internet:

https://www.rheinmetall-defence.com/en/rheinmetall_defence/systems_and_products/vehicle_systems/armoured_tracked_vehicles/panther_kf51/index.php

YouTube

Rheinmetall releases Panther KF51 Main Battle Tank

A new tank for a new era: Panther KF51 is Rheinmetall's new main battle tank, setting unprecedented standards in lethality, protection, survivability, reconn...

Another forum had these specs (will need subsequent confirmation)

And some preliminary info on the 130mm; reportedly 50% more energy/effect then the 120mm.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rheinmetall_Rh-120#Rheinmetall_Rh-130_L/51

Msg 2 of 432 to gatnerdgatnerd

In reply toRe: msg 1

From: schnuersi

14/6/22

gatnerd said:
widely being heralded as the Panther 2 on the internet:

Even though its technically the Panther 3. :)

gatnerd said:
Another forum had these specs (will need subsequent confirmation)

THis is from the Rh homepage. It can be concidered confirmed.

Its important to keep a few things in mind to put the Panther into perspective. Its a pure industrial project. The German military has no stakes in it. Its a demonstrator to show what RH can currently offer. As such all configurations are optional. On the hompage Rh states the prototype is currently fitted with a new Rh RWS called Natter but any other can be fitted.
The Panther in essence is a upgraded Leopard hull with a significantly redesigned turret. So its actually a Leopard 2.5. This is the reason for the rather high weight. It also explains why it still uses a traditional crewed turret. Even though Rh states a crew in hull setup is also possible.

Most likely Rh wants to show that for a Leopard 3 project by the German military no international colaboration is needed. They are positioning themself should MGCS fail. Which is what it currently looks like. Should Rh manage to actually find customers MGCS will get even more unlikely.

Edited 14 June 2022 4:45 by schnuersi

Msg 3 of 432 to schnuersischnuersi

In reply toRe: msg 2

From: EmericD

14/6/22

schnuersi said:
Most likely Rh wants to show that for a Leopard 3 project by the German military no international colaboration is needed. They are positioning themself should MGCS fail. Which is what it currently looks like. Should Rh manage to actually find customers MGCS will get even more unlikely.

They are doing much more than that, they are actively trying to make MGCS fail, with the help of people who didn't like the merge of KMW and Nexter.

And the announcement of the German government to buy F-35 is a signal that SCAF will probably fail also.

Msg 4 of 432 to EmericDEmericD

In reply toRe: msg 3

From: schnuersi

14/6/22

EmericD said:
They are doing much more than that, they are actively trying to make MGCS fail, with the help of people who didn't like the merge of KMW and Nexter.

According to the people at KMW I talked to Nexter and the french MoD are doing a fine job of making it fail by themself.

EmericD said:
And the announcement of the German government to buy F-35 is a signal that SCAF will probably fail also.

My knowledge of aircraft projects is limited but as far as I know F-35 and FCAS are two completly different things. FCAS is supposed to replace the Typhoon. F-35 is replacing Tornado. Which has to be replaced quickly. FCAS is sheduled for the '40s.

In the past multi national programs rarely really succeed. It got worse in the last decades. Even Tiger, one of the most high profile programs, is a hot mess. Most likely its best when the progams are national, maybe with some junior partners, and after they are finished they are sold on the market. This way everybody can decide what fits their needs best.

Msg 5 of 432 to schnuersischnuersi

In reply toRe: msg 4

From: graylion

14/6/22

schnuersi said:
Most likely its best when the progams are national, maybe with some junior partners, and after they are finished they are sold on the market. This way everybody can decide what fits their needs best.

Or just industry. like AW149, which currently is my favourite chopper in that weight class.