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Based on Malachi 3:16-18 I believe the Lord will harken to us as we consider his word together.

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we need to obey the Law.   General Discussion

Started Aug-16 by PAULFROMNYS; 1030 views.
Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-11

JS5777 said:

The New Jerusalem (if you are ONLY looking at buildings)

I would say that the New Jerusalem has nothing whatsoever to do with buildings. All the dimensions, the material, the river, the tree, the street, jasper, gold, precious stones, each of the 12 gates being one pearl, all have to be interpreted in the light of the Scriptures.

The building in the Bible is the building of God into man through incarnation, and the building of man into God through resurrection. The New Jerusalem is the ultimate consummation of God's building work throughout the ages. 

Consider  the pearl gates. 

A pearl is produced by a wounded oyster secreting its life juice upon the wounding grain of sand. Over time it produces a gem. This is an allegory. Christ came into the death waters of the world and was wounded. When His side was pierced, blood and water flowed out. Blood for our redemption and water for life producing. He thusly became our "entrance" into the Holy City. 

In addition, when we remain in Christ's death, by the power of His resurrection, we become "gates" for others to enter through our living and gospel preaching.

Philippians 3:10-11 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

You could write a book just on the significance of the pearl gates. 

We do not go to church, we are the church...24/7. We are not going to the New Jerusalem, we are becoming the New Jerusalem. The New Jerusalem is us.

marvinlzinn1

From: marvinlzinn1

Sep-12

I agree. Spiritual matters are all that really count for eternity.

marvin

Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-12

Amen. May God open our eyes to see the spiritual things, the things that are out from God and are God. He is wonderful! This thread is called "we need to obey the law"

Here is the law: 

Luke 10:26-27 He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself.

O, how I love Jesus!!!!!!

JS5777

From: JS5777

Sep-12

Many times the carnal mind tries to artificially make a complete disconnect between the natural/physical/material and the spiritual.

Part of the reason for this is because of the contamination of Christian thought by combining it with Greek existential philosophy.

Greek existential philosophy concludes that ALL natural/physical/material existence is inherently evil.

It is from that corruption of Christian thought that the fictional work of the Book of Judas Iscariot comes from, which concludes that Judas Iscariot was the great hero of the story because through the betrayal, he liberated the Christ from the evil of physical existence.

But it DOES NOT consider that BEFORE the fall in  sin, absolutely nothing of physical existence was inherently evil.

Corruption, evil, decay and death ALL entered into the earth through the fall in sin, and ALL of those things will eventually be done away through the restoration of all things, and will therefore be restored back to the original pure and perfect order that God created for it to be in.

Therefore, in the end, when everything is restored, God will be able to say again that it is "very good" (Gen 1:31).

Therefore, there is not a TOTAL disconnect between the spiritual and the natural, but rather, as is shown in multiple places, the natural types the spiritual and the spiritual types the natural, but in ways that display the perfect order that is the will of God.

It is for these reasons that I do not ascribe to the thought that the New Jerusalem is ONLY spiritual, and neither do I ascribe to the thought that the New Jerusalem is ONLY natural, it is BOTH spiritual AND natural in the perfect harmony that God originally intended in the beginning, so also will it be in the end.

So also is it with the Law. The letter alone. without the Spirit to bring it to Life, killeth. But, when the Spirit moves upon the Word to bring it to be a living reality in the believer, it is Life, the Spiritual and the natural coming together again in salvation and restoration.

 

Shalom,

JS5777

  • Edited September 12, 2022 11:56 am  by  JS5777
PAULFROMNYS

From: PAULFROMNYS

Sep-12

    Gates were likened by TAS to counsels.  I like that.  We enter through each gate according to some counsel, or properly expressed attribute of life??

PAULFROMNYS

From: PAULFROMNYS

Sep-12

   James:  So also is it with the Law. The letter alone. without the Spirit to bring it to Life, killeth. But, when the Spirit moves upon the Word to bring it to be a living reality in the believer, it is Life, the Spiritual and the natural coming together again in salvation and restoration.

   Paul:   For ABSOLUTE sure.

Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-12

JS5777 said:

It is for these reasons that I do not ascribe to the thought that the New Jerusalem is ONLY spiritual, and neither do I ascribe to the thought that the New Jerusalem is ONLY natural, it is BOTH spiritual AND natural in the perfect harmony that God originally intended in the beginning, so also will it be in the end.

So if we apply this to the church, God's dwelling place, would you say that the church has both a natural and spiritual aspect?

1 Corinthians 15:46-47 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

In other words, the church is the bride of Christ, His counterpart, and the New Jerusalem is the bride of Christ, according to the Scriptures. Do you believe that the church is becoming both spiritual dwelling place of God, joined to the Lord, and a physical city?

JS5777

From: JS5777

Sep-13

The difference is that the Church is "becoming" but is still not in perfectly restored bodies.

The New Jerusalem is the Bride that has become Wife and IS in perfectly restored bodies.

And so shall we ever be with the Lord.

 

Shalom,

JS5777

PAULFROMNYS

From: PAULFROMNYS

Sep-13

   Yes, If Paul could say he had not apprehended, then I feel safe in saying none are perfectly restored.  Jesus on the mount of transfiguration is shown in perfection I believe, but He alone is that reality realized in the flesh of fallen man.

Fred (fnorthrup)

From: Fred (fnorthrup)

Sep-13

JS5777 said:

The difference is that the Church is "becoming" but is still not in perfectly restored bodies. The New Jerusalem is the Bride that has become Wife and IS in perfectly restored bodies. And so shall we ever be with the Lord.

This is true. We are "becoming." 

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

The Lord Jesus has already "become."

1 Corinthians 15:45b the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

"was made" is the Greek preposition eis, or into. It indicates motion from one place to another place. The last Adam was God manifested in the flesh (1 Timothy 3:16), with a natural, physical body. He left there, and is now in the Spirit, having a body that is entirely Spirit. First he was the word that became flesh, now He has become a life-giving Spirit. 

What is a city? It is an incorporated corporate person. When we say "Buffalo, NY", we are not talking about buildings, we are talking about a group of many people who have been incorporated into one entity, "Buffalo". 

What is the bride? The bride is an incorporated (corp meaning body, in-corp, "in one body.") corporate person. The Biblical example of an incorporated, corporate person is a city. It is also a husband and wife.

Eventually the bride becomes the counterpart of Christ, who is the Spirit. The Spirit and the bride are one corporate person. This is the New Jerusalem. It really has absolutely nothing to do with physical buildings. The New Jerusalem signifies the consummation of God's building work through the ages, it the end result of God "building the rib into a woman and bringing her to the man."  It is the fulfillment of Jacob's dream. The "descending" is God being built into man. The "ascending" is man being built into God. This is Bethel. The entire Bible is about this one thing.

2 Corinthians 3:17-18 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

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