Hammer Dog (jaime59)

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Arm swing for amateurs - says Padraig.   Swing Instructions, Tips, etc.

Started Jun-27 by BOGEYSBGONE; 476 views.
BOGEYSBGONE

From: BOGEYSBGONE

Jun-27

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GQ2GxL2ihg

Thank goodness!   I appreciate a pro giving a tip that is at least sounds "hopeful" to guys like me.    He says for amateurs use the arms wrists and hands to swing - not the body to swing the arms blah blah blah.    Cool!  Hope this helps - or at least gives hope to some GEAers.  :)

Robb

RipperX

From: RipperX

Jun-27

Nice. I like that

In reply toRe: msg 1
V-Blade (VSDtrek1)

From: V-Blade (VSDtrek1)

Jun-27

I like this tip and already do it for the most part.  Probably because I am not particularly limber.  I think it helps save my back.  
 

I would have eventually slapped at least one into that building.  Years ago, I tried clearing my house with a LW.  Started with the first story and when that attempt was a bit too close, decided to skip the second.  

presser15

From: presser15

Jun-27

Did it today and will do it again tomorrow just needed someone  like Padraig to say it I am through fighting to use my body in the swing

BOGEYSBGONE

From: BOGEYSBGONE

Jun-27

presser15 said...
 

 

Did it today and will do it again tomorrow just needed someone  like Padraig to say it I am through fighting to use my body in the swing

 

Yeah!!!!

Robb

And here's why it works.

Increasing Your Golf Club Head Speed ?‍?? | Pros vs. Ams

If you want more solid, iron shots, check out our FREE training https://athleticmotiongolf.com/free-compression/ ------------------------------------------...

Going back to Ernest Jones who lost a leg in WWI and learned to play one leg, then went on to a career as a teacher and his disciple Manuel DeLaTorre, a swing of the arms and hands is never a bad thing.

Jones wrote that learning to play, and shoot in the 70s, standing on one leg made him realize that everything he knew about golf was wrong.  

You can only make use of your body AFTER you have an excellent arm swing. The problem is that SO many teachers and good golfers can't remember how they learned to play, all they know is that as developed players they think about driving the swing with their body.  

Bob Toski and Jim Flick said, "A swing can create a turn, but a turn can not create a swing."

Flick also said, the goal is "a free swing of the arms FROM the shoulders, not with the shoulders."

Husker (Birdman506)

From: Husker (Birdman506)

Jun-28

Thank you for your last two posts.  Good information.  THAT is the golf forum I remember.

BOGEYSBGONE

From: BOGEYSBGONE

Jun-28

ken1putt (kenoneputt) said...

 

Going back to Ernest Jones who lost a leg in WWI and learned to play one leg, then went on to a career as a teacher and his disciple Manuel DeLaTorre, a swing of the arms and hands is never a bad thing.

Jones wrote that learning to play, and shoot in the 70s, standing on one leg made him realize that everything he knew about golf was wrong.  

You can only make use of your body AFTER you have an excellent arm swing. The problem is that SO many teachers and good golfers can't remember how they learned to play, all they know is that as developed players they think about driving the swing with their body.  

Bob Toski and Jim Flick said, "A swing can create a turn, but a turn can not create a swing."

Flick also said, the goal is "a free swing of the arms FROM the shoulders, not with the shoulders."

 

Nice!

So - can you describe Flick's theory of the swing - I believe he is "swing the arms" and let the body react/get out of the way"?    

According to you:

1) what do you do to create a powerful and effective full swing? with irons? with driver?

2) What does it feel like?

3) when do you do it? 

I realize that everyone is different in terms of describing perceiving and interpreting - but I'd appreciate it if you could try?  :)

My belief is that I possess the physical ability to hit the ball farther.  But my misapplication of physics kills that ability.   My goal is to play golf like an athlete - copy the motions I've used in other sports and produce good results with golf.   That's how I learned to play - and by mimicking feels and motions in baseball (pitcher/3rd and short); lacrosse (attack); tennis (played to a 3.5-4.0 rating) for some reason - I can not hit the golf ball out of my shadow.   I am of the belief that I possess the muscular strength and coordination to swing the club head fast enough but my biomechanics delivery of the clubhead at impact is flawed - probably in multiple areas.

I have probably tried to swing the club with my body - for about 10 years - and it's produced a slower swing.  One gadget that has helped me curiously (I say that b/c I don't know how it works) is the Orange Whip.   Simply put - if I were allowed to swing the Orange Whip one or two times before every shot - my distance would probably be off the chart and I'd be ecstatic.   And I can't figure out why?

Anyways - I'd appreciate your views  Ken - thanks!   Should be a fun discussion.

Robb, IMHO the Orange Whip and Whippy Tempomaster are effective because it is impossible to use leverage to swing them. Leverage is an Ernest Jones term that he uses to describe "pushing" the grip with the hands.

There's plenty of Jones' wisdom on the Web so I took a few minutes to find some stuff that might resonate with you. But I think it depends a lot on how tall you are.  Are you under 5'10"? Because this isn't going to help tall golfers as much as short ones.

This http://www.ruthlessgolf.com/2018/01/ernest-jones-on-creating-clubhead-speed.html has some stuff in it that relates to things I said earlier about the Right Inside Throw release. It also mentions Hogan, who said wished he had three right hands at impact.

That made ZERO sense to me coming from a guy whose hook nearly drove him out of pro golf. But when I get into the right position on the downswing, I can feel EXACTLY what he was talking about.  To do it, I need to put the clubshaft behind my neck, start down with a move of the hands and arms, and THEN I can go after the ball. 

I still only hit it 190 yards, but I am 72 years old, 5'8" and not at all athletic. (I joke that I don't play any sports where the ball comes toward me. I can't catch for  shit, and throw like there's something wrong with my arm.)

Back on topic:

I found three videos that help explain the Jones method, which also explains why the whippy trainers work.  I'll put them in another post, probably start a new thread.

By the way, you can't use an Orange Whip on the golf course, because it is a training aid, but the whippy shafted golf clubs are perfectly legal and is you stay under 14 clubs, can be carried and used to help with the feel.  I've built six or seven using a driveway marker stake as a shaft. It's the fiberglass stake that started the alignment sticks movement, but only costs two or three bucks at Home Depot. 

Re. the short vs. tall thing, Here's Hogan, with the shaft behind his neck.

And here's Johnny Miller

There's no way those two could generate speed the same way.

Several years ago Johnny was a speaker at the Golf Industry Show, and watching him on stage was interesting. He had a driver with him and was making full-speed swing with it using only his left hand. it is IMPOSSIBLE to do that from Hogan's backswing position.  And if you try to apply any right hand from Miller's position, you'll hit a massive pull hook.

That's why Jim Hardy's comments on two releases was so enlightening. Miller is pulling the club down from the top with his left hand and using a rotational release.

Hogan is letting his hands fall from the top, or pushing them down, then throwing the clubhead from the inside with his right hand.  It feels like a total block swing when I do it, but the ball goes farther and straighter.

Like Jones, I learned something about playing from losing the use of a limb (temporarily) when I had carpal tunnel surgery on my right hand. I played while I still had the bandages on, and my driving was  AMAZING. 

I cradled the shaft in the crook of my thumb and index finger, took it back low because I couldn't lift it with one hand, then one the downswing gave it a good push the right hand and finished one-handed.

My problem, as an unathletic putz, is that I can't do it reliably.

My backswing gets too long, my hands get too high, I turn too soon and I use my hands too much, too soon.

And the ball goes left, WAY left.

More to come

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