Hammer Dog (jaime59)

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Follow The Science   Futility Folder:Politics

Started Oct-5 by MikeJA; 5965 views.

From: MikeJA


For the third time in less than a month, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has altered its guidance on how Covid-19 spreads. The agency said Monday that airborne transmission is possible, but that it's not the most common way the virus travels from person to person — a position that was published and then removed from its website in September.

The CDC updated its page on the spread of virus Monday to say that "some infections can be spread by exposure to virus in small droplets and particles that can linger in the air for minutes to hours."


The last one is for the most part correct and confirms that paper and cloth masks do not work. If you are old or vulnerable avoid indoor areas when they are even modestly crowded. The mask won’t stop the virus during exhale. The modest mask flow resistance will limit the flow velocity and range to some extent but not the conservation of exhaled virus mass. The virus will remain suspended as a 1 micron aerosol for up to hours, even more so with the lower exhaled velocities through a mask, especially indoors. Your mask won’t stop you from inhaling the still suspended virus exhaled by somebody that was there an hour or more ago.

Even though I’m not an expert on epidemiology, virus control, etc., there were three world renowned experts on that subject on Laura Ingraham’s Fox News show tonight that parroted what I’ve posted here and on Hal’s forum since around February about common sense Covid strategy.

I am at least somewhat of an expert on masks. My PhD from UCSD was on transport and chemical reactions in porous media, with some new theoretical derivations from first principles. If two individuals were having a face-off spitting, sneezing, or coughing contest then a cloth or paper mask could provide some protection. I’ll give Jaime that much.

Hammer Dog (jaime59)

Theoretically, in perfect conditions, smaller aerosols can remain suspended for hours.  In the real world, they disperse and dilute. Masks, of any type, prevent projection of concentrated aerosols by the wearer and allow them to be diluted by air currents and movement.


From: Charlie6D


Considering how long these tiny CV molecules can remain suspended in air, it seems reasonable to me to think that 80% to 90% of ALL Americans have been exposed (at some level) to the virus at some point in the past 6 to 8 months.  Therefore, whether a person actually "catches" the virus must depend on the degree of exposure (virus load) and their resistance to the virus.


Wrong. Lower range means higher concentration. And indoors their is no rapid dispersion or settling.

Another failure in our response to the virus is a program for randomized antibody testing on a regional basis. That would provide an accurate estimate of actual infections by region, age demographic, etc., and would better inform our response activities. Instead we have unnecessarily set a new galaxy record for testing for the virus itself.

Hammer Dog (jaime59)

Commercial office buildings are mechanically ventilated and air is moving constantly, unlike your home HVAC system.

I don't know what "lower range means higher concentration" means.

Even with HVAC, crowded indoor locations are going to have higher concentrations in the air with or without masks. The flow resistance of the mask can reduce the effective range of your breath somewhat but not the volume. Same volume over shorter distance equals higher local concentration.

Hammer Dog (jaime59)

Higher concentration around the person breathing until that person moves, which disperses and dilutes whatever they just exhaled.

Burat (DocFreddie)

From: Burat (DocFreddie)


There is no doubt that masks will NOT prevent viral particles from escaping into the surrounding atmosphere.

The question is at what concentrations do they become infectious.

There are so many variables that come into play, I doubt any test can ever answer this question.

My bottom line: masks help, but they are not foolproof.

Since they help, what is the harm in using one?